Tuesday Question: One That Bears (LOL) Repeating
by Juco All-American on Nov 8, 2011 11:19 AM EST
in 2011 Ole Miss Rebels Football
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PrintGenerally, we are the "authors" of "content" around here - "here" being a blog and not a message board. Recognize, we do, that you've come here not to contribute, but to consume. Nevertheless, there is the sporadic occasion where, either for our benefit or for to exercise the thinkifiers of the masses, we ask you a question. Today's question is . . .
Who should be the next head coach of our football team?
We had a Monday Discussion on the same topic immediately following the loss to Vanderbilt. I'm interested to see whether opinions have changed.
Back then, I said Kevin Sumlin. I was the first to mention him, and a couple of people agreed with me. I would guess the numbers supporting him are higher now. Therefore I'm going to take credit for the "Kevin Sumlin to Ole Miss" meme. A lot of y'all are tossing around names like Alabama DC Kirby Smart, Auburn OC Gus Malzhan, and the unemployed Mike Leach. Who would you, dear reader, like to see and why? We've got a poll up and a comments section which needs fillin', so get to it.
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My choices
In order of preference:
Mike Leach (I know it won’t happen, but we can dream), Skip Holtz (not happening either), Charlie Strong, Kevin Sumlin, Kirby Smart, Venables, possibly Malzahn. I’m sure I’m forgetting a couple names, but after the ones already mentioned, I can’t think of anyone who would be a good fit or get me excited.
Ok guys..
Let’s put this into perspective a little when talking about this hire. In particular talking about Hugh Freeze.
I will compare it to the recent hiring of Theo with my beloved Chicago Cubs and his impending managerial hire.
The team needs a home-run hire. Freeze is in some degree like Sandberg. He is the elephant in the room. The fan favorite choice with a lot of people. Truth be told…he probably will be a hell of a good coach. He just isn’t the right hire for right now.
Theo rightfully is looking for a proven big league coach. One that can rebuild. Let Ryno cut his chops somewhere else and down the line probably bring him in. You don’t want to ruin his status with the fans when you know it isn’t the best position to put him in to succeed.
Ole Miss needs a solid, home-run hire here. Not someone that is still very unproven but has potential.
by ProphetMB on Nov 8, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
Very well said, he is a great guy and a great coach, not the right time.
"Everybody relax, I'm here." - Jack Burton
by HottyToddyBraves on Nov 8, 2011 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
You're exactly right about this one.
We need to recruit either Albert Pujols or Prince Fielder to play for us, then get a proven coach. I’ve heard that Tony LaRussa just quit his job.
by Operation_Masoli_Freedom on Nov 8, 2011 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
And a Home Run Hire is Gonna be near Impossible
Considering UNC, Ohio State, Penn State, and UCLA are all going to be hiring too.
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 9, 2011 9:58 AM EST up reply actions
I've got four that I'd be very happy with, and then a few that I'd be okay with.
Leach, RichRod, Smart, and Sumlin are at the top of my list. I think each of them brings something unique to the table, and I think each could do some really nice things in Oxford. (Side note: I reserve the right to add Venables to this list, though frankly, I don’t know enough about him to put him in yet).
Below those four, I’d be okay with Fedora, Freeze, and Malzahn. I’d like to see Fedora and Freeze win consistently for a bit longer before making the jump from non-BCS schools, and I’m not 100% sold on Malzahn as the offensive genius people seem to think he is. Still, I think each of those three have the potential to be good fits, though there are too many questions about each for me to be thrilled with them.
I’m not convinced at all that Skip Holtz would be a good hire. Anyone who argues for Kent Austin should be immediately ignored.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 11:29 AM EST reply actions
I can understand the hesitancy on Skip Holtz
I won’t begrudge you that. I, personally, am not a fan of RichRod at all and really don’t want to see him coaching our team. I agree completely with Leach, Smart and Sumlin. I’d rather have Sumlin than Smart though. I’d like to see us hire an up-and-coming coach who has already been a head coach and seen some success. I would prefer that we didn’t hire Hugh Freeze, though I like him as a person and think he could be a very nice coach down the road. I think Fedora’s style of play would be an awful fit in the SEC.
I'm not the biggest fan of RichRod
but I do think our offense is built for his style, and he proved at WVU that he could take that system and win big with it. I do think Freeze will be solid in the future, but he’s still largely unproven (thus my questions about him), and Fedora’s style is what led to my questions about him.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I was hesitant on Rich Rod
but if we made it clear that a good defensive coordinator would be a necessity, I think that would account for his shortcomings. I haven’t kept up with it, but would Tracy Rocker be interested in a DC position? Or is he unqualified and is just a great D-Line coach?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
I think Tracy Rocker
would be a great choice for defensive coordinator. He’s the kind of defensive guy I would want on the staff if we hired Sumlin, Leach, Rich Rod, Malzahn, etc.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
Plus
he’s known for being a sick recruiter, especially with defensive lineman. And as well all know, the SEC is a league driven by the D-Line. Any time there is an SEC team performing above expectations, it always seems that their defensive line is the strongest unit on the team. Hell, from top to bottom, Auburn’s d-line was much a more important factor in the national championship game last season than Cam Newton. Without Nick Fairly, Auburn loses that game methinks.
South Carolina’s resurgence has coincided with players like Melvin Ingram, Eric Norwood (Bradley Sowell’s nemesis), Jadaveon Clowney et al. The Florida team from 2006 beat OSU almost wholly because their D-line was loaded with speed and size. LSU had Glenn Dorsey in 2007. The list goes on and on.
Looking at the teams from 2008 and 2009, I don’t think our linebackers or defensive backs had a noticeable drop in talent (injuries aside). However, the quality of our defensive line kept our D in the top 25 those first two years while the previous two seasons we’ve been mediocre to just bad at generating pressure with a four man rush and keeping offensive lineman off the linebackers.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
I had about a
30 minute conversation last night with a friend about how dominant that defensive line was in 2008 and 2009. I agree with you that the decrease in talent at that position has hurt us more than anything else on that side of the ball.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
sowell
two points…
a) Eric Norwood was everyone’s nemesis
b) I’m not convinced Bradley Sowell could block Tyler Campbell from getting in the backfield
I listen for the voice inside my head... nothin... I'll do this one myself
Then you have never objectively watched Sowell. He is by far the best OL we have and he will play on Sundays. Most, not all mind you, of his blocking “mistakes” are either him trying to do 2 people’s jobs or poor schemes.
by astaylo1 on Nov 8, 2011 2:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Sowell won't make it long in the NFL once he kills enough drives with holding and false start penalties.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Sowell has more false starts
than any other lineman this season.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Sowell remains my least favorite Rebel ever.
Chairwoman of the "Blood Is Thicker Than Tuition Money" Committee for Fan Bigamy
The best he has ever been
is serviceable. He doesn’t look like he’s improved one bit since that South Cackalack game in 2009.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
En-RICKY didn't say that he was happy to have gotten the inevitable loss out of the way
after the 2009 Sakerlina game.
Chairwoman of the "Blood Is Thicker Than Tuition Money" Committee for Fan Bigamy
Being the best on our OL
is like being the best at a sack race, everyone looks like shit, and why would you want to race in a sack anyways?
"Everybody relax, I'm here." - Jack Burton
by HottyToddyBraves on Nov 8, 2011 6:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You're the person who voted for Sowell 15 times for player of the week, aren't you!?!
That bastard has more yards in penalties than Randall Mackey does passing. Is he overrated? “You damned right.”
He had a particularly awesome
false start on a 3rd and 4 against Vandy when we were only down one touchdown.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
The note about getting a good DC would have to be made clear if Leach came here too.
Leach without a good DC would lose a lot of games in the SEC.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Huge advocate
for Tracy Rocker, no lie about the recruiting skills and he is just a sick coach that D line players gravitate to.
"Everybody relax, I'm here." - Jack Burton
by HottyToddyBraves on Nov 8, 2011 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
One thing you have to remember is....
That money is no option. We can all throw the same names out, and we have to some extent, but I would not be surprised if we go after a guy that is totally off the radar. Then we sit back, think about it for a second, and then say to ourselves, “okay, this makes sense”
by Relentless Rebel on Nov 8, 2011 11:41 AM EST reply actions
Going off the radar is exactly what I'm afraid of.
Ole Miss usually does that and it hasn’t worked out yet.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Mike Leach, then Rich Rod
Leach has been successful in a smaller market team in a big conference. His teams are exciting (yes scoring points puts people in the stands) and he can offer croots something that other SEC schools cannot. Will he beat Alabama and LSU every year? No. Will we be competitive? I think so. I will say that I cannot see a Mike Leach team getting consistently embarrassed against Kentucky and Vandy.
I like Freeze, but I am not ready to take a chance on someone. Call me impatient.
My short laundry list
Rich Rodriguez – doesn’t have to wait for spread players to come in. Would have a couple dual-threat qb’s, decent rb’s, and the best stable of receivers he will have ever had. Plus have an easy path to Anthony Alford or Jeremy Liggins in the recruiting trail. As long as he is willing to let his defensive coordinator run HIS scheme and not the 3-3-5, he can win. According to the Commercial Appeal, he is willing to talk if mutual interest, and he is interested.
Skip Holtz – as a Marshall fan, I remember ECU going from easy win to, oh hell, ECU. He has always been a good coach.
Hugh Freeze – a risky, but could be blockbuster bet. Kind of unproven, but no matter where he seems to go, he wins and wins quickly. May be one of the few who would be willing to be here and be here for the long haul. Would hit that I-55 corridor from Memphis to Jackson HARD recruiting and get some of the best talent out of that area here quickly.
Anthony Alford
would be a sick sick sick QB in Rich Rod’s offense. But I fear he will go pro in baseball.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think Liggins is a fantastic athlete
but his throwing motion is just so slow. He has a good deep ball, but doesn’t seem to put much zip on it, especially with the underneath routes. However, when he starts running, man is he tough to stop.
However, if Mullen figured out a way to get Chris Relf to throw a spiral, surely a decent QB coach could shorten Liggins’ throwing motion.
I’m just really high on Alford because he has a cannon for an arm and looks a little quicker than Liggins.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
Either one you bring in *knock on wood*
You have Mackey and Brunetti to run the system, so time to develop either in a redshirt year and another under Brunetti
I said then....
As I will say now. My first call would go to Manny Diaz. After that, I would be fine with any of Strong, Smart, Summlin, or Venables. I really don’t want another “old” coach. I guess Leach would work, but I really don’t RichRod anywhere near Oxford. Fedora is, I’m hoping, someone trolling super hard.
by astaylo1 on Nov 8, 2011 11:44 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I like Kevin Sumlin,
but after careful reconsideration, I don’t think I’d have an issue with Mike Leach. I think this is actually a prime opportunity to get a decent coach. In looking at potential vacancies this year, there aren’t too many. Coupled with a large number of coordinators and head coaches at smaller schools looking to make a jump, I doubt we’ll end up hiring some insane defensive line coach.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:47 AM EST reply actions
But to be serious
I’d love to see Mike Leach, but it probably won’t happen..
by TylerCambellforHeisman on Nov 8, 2011 11:52 AM EST reply actions
Here we go again. I am not taking issue with letting Nutt go, but I am pessimistic that any good comes out of this (I hope I am wrong). The last 35 years goes something like this: we fired Cooper after four years, hired Sloan; Sloan left after four years (thank you Duke), hired Brewer; fired Brewer after ten years and two run-ins with the NCAA, hired Tuberville; After four years, Tubs goes to Auburn , hired Cutcliff; fired Cutcliff after five years, hired Orgeron; fired O after three years, hired Nutt; fired Nutt after four years, hire???? With six opportunities, we haven’t got it right yet. Of those hired during this time, only Sloan and Nutt had Div. 1 head coaching experience. Tubbs was probably the best of all coaching wise, but he turned out to be pretty sorry as a person (Btw, Boone hired Tubbs, fired Cutcliff, hired and fired O, hired and fired Nutt.). See the pattern? What are they going to do to make the right hire this time?
As to Leach or RichRod, neither of these offer much defensively. In this conference, especially in the west, defense rules.
I think you're right,
but I think everyone here would qualify their case for Leach or RichRod with “But he MUST get a quality defensive coordinator and leave defensive playcalling up to whoever they hire.”
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
Juco, a question for you
Is your mailbox at the street or is it attached to your house? Just a harmless squirrel not a plastic explosive or anything, nothing to be worried about…you know doctor’s orders and so forth
So y'all really like Sumlin eh?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
with a small wave of my hand:
This isn’t the coach you’re looking for.
by uh...um... on Nov 8, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I know attempting to hire away Vandy's..
HC is not typically a recipe for success (see Gerry DiNardo to LSU), but I really like the enthusiasm and approach James Franklin has taken at Vandy.
He isn’t one to bitch and moan about the short-comings of his athletic department. Instead, he seems to have the attitude to just get the job done. He definitely wouldn’t take any shit from Mullen. Also he’s a really good recruiter, and surely he could do more with what we have at Ole Miss, as far as talent and resources.
Finally, after several years of an apparent lack of discipline pervading the team, I think his approach could be a real boost for our players’ morale.
I think the biggest issue is
why would he leave Nashville for Oxford? Vanderbilt is better than us right now, so I don’t know why he’d want to move to a much more competitive division to resurrect a program…again.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
Plus he's only logged a year there.
If he’s really interested in jumping from Vandy, you’d have to think he’ll want to spend another year or two building his stock so he can jump to a bigger school.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
precisely
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
I agree there are compelling reasons for him to stay at Vandy. I just was suggesting him as someone that, as an Ole Miss fan, I think would be a good fit from our perspective. I definitely think it’s somewhat of a longshot, which really sums up the sad state of our football program.
by Bro. Mouzone on Nov 8, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
The last time we hired from Vandy, we got this:
Steve Sloan.
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
Or, the last time we hired from Texas Tech
Is that more baggage for Leach?
I doubt he'd want to do that.
Smart’s from the Saban school of game management. I’d wager he’s going to want a traditional, grind-it-out, run-first offense.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
I like Smart,
I just worry that Saban’s system doesn’t work without Saban himself (or perhaps that Saban actually has control over the defense and Smart is a yes-man). Though many of the Sabanites have jobs at good programs, none of them have impressed me with their head-coaching prowess yet.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
I cannot swear any of it is true.
But I’ve seen a lot of comments that Kirby Smart is little more than a figurehead and Saban basically runs the Bama defense. It could be Bama fans hoping if they say it enough it’ll throw everyone off of going after him, because I’ve also noticed a lot of Bama fans aren’t happy his name even comes up in coaching vacancies.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
You could be right...
But if Smart is just a yes man, he’s a very highly paid one, which suggests to me that he is more valuable to Saban and Alabama than your typical boot-polisher.
Eschew obfuscation.
My guess is he is more than a yes-man.
I can’t believe even Alabama would blow that much money on somebody who does little to nothing if Saban could just do it himself.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Sumlin is my top (potentially realistic) choice.
I prefer a guy who has had success as head coach at a school with similar challenges (recruiting against schools with better reputations and deeper pockets) than a coordinator looking for his first HC gig. (Obviously I’d take Leach in a heartbeat, but he ain’t coming.)
Chairwoman of the "Blood Is Thicker Than Tuition Money" Committee for Fan Bigamy
He seemed to express interest
yesterday as did Rich Rod. Leach has made it clear that he wants to coach, especially in the SEC. However, I voted for Sumlin because I think his work at Houston has prepared him well for the challenges that the Ole Miss job would present.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 12:36 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with Sumlin idea.
Sumlin would be able to recruit well in the SEC and that kind of football would be fun to watch. He is moving up in my ranks them more and more I think about it. I also like Leach, but I think Sumlin could be the better all around choice. I think many alum would untimately have some problems with Leach. K Smart is very cocky and I’m not sure his ego would allow him to come to Ole Miss.
I wanna throw this out there:
Terry Bowden? He’s not done a bad job at UNA, from what I’ve heard, and he’s familiar with coaching at a tradition-rich big school ((fuck) Clemson).
Ambitious, but rubbish.
Do what
Terry Bowden – sketchy Auburn and UNA coach. Tommy Bowden – went to a bowl game every year at CU, save after winning the Palmetto Brawl and that year he went crazy and got canned midway through the season.
Both are terrible ideas because they, like our current zombie coach, are zombie coaches.
Long-time reader, first-time typer... Imma quit typin and read.
I've got a crazy pick for HC of our program
and I am worried I will be chastised on this blog for it but here goes: Jim Tressel
Just to name a few reasons why:
3rd winningest coach at Ohio State
Never had a losing season at Ohio State
National Champion in ‘02
Bowl games every year at Ohio State
rocks a sweater vest better then anyone I’ve ever seen (everyone could throw away their “Nutt Sombreros” in lieu of a sweet ass “Tressel Vest”)
I know it’s crazy but he’s got a ton of experience and he’s pretty much brilliant.
As far as the voting list above, I’ve got Leach, Sumilin, and Malzahn on my short list.
I don't want to see Ole Miss go back on probation.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
I see your point there
but let’s not discount Mike or Rich’s past either. Both have had issues and both are excellent coaches but neither have been to the National Champs. A guy with experience on the big stage like that might help our guys realize that it is entirely possible.
And neither of the other two have show cause rulings from the NCAA on their heads. We would have to jump through a ton of hoops just to get him here and then have to walk on pins and needles te entire time. No thanks.
by astaylo1 on Nov 8, 2011 2:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I've brought up Leach's past plenty on here.
But when did he, or Rodriguez for that matter, have issues with the NCAA? It’s not going to matter if he wins if the NCAA comes in and shuts it down and takes away 20 scholarships because you broke the rules either.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
He'd never take the job.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 1:28 PM EST up reply actions
Tressel has issues.
He’d still be coaching if he just walked ten feet down to the compliance office, but he made the decision not to, and that’s why he’s not coaching anymore.
Tressel’s image in Ohio is still beloved despite his departure, and taking the job at Ole Miss would upset a lot of people (because it’s not Ohio State). He’s more likely to stay in the pros if anywhere.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
Does Ole Miss even have a sweater vest?
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
I have several.
And it is now sweater vest season.
"There's no better way to say 'I'm a badass' than the thumbs up. It's so hot right now."
I like Sumlin but
I have heard the argument against Malzahn being that if he didn’t have Cam, his stock wouldn’t be so high. The year Case Keenum got hurt Houston went 5-7. Both are good candidates, but it’s just something to think about amongst all this fantastic speculation
The Houston offense still put up tons of yards
in the year they went 5-7. Also, they were starting a third string quarterback…. a true freshman.
Red Cup Rebellion - An Ole Miss Blog
Turns out that we're not very good at football.
by Juco All-American on Nov 8, 2011 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
I just got a text message from a friend
that says, “Media person asked Charlie Strong out of the blue: Strong said ’no way in hell I would take the Ole Miss job”
God that stings. Charlie Strong, why do you hurt?
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 12:53 PM EST reply actions
If it's true...
…can you blame him? Knowing if he doesn’t produce consistently in less than 4 years he’ll be canned (read our history)…
The Virginia quake that registered in August 2011 was the direct result of the United States Government bouncing a $14 Trillion Check.
No I can't blame him,
but that doesn’t mean it didn’t make me cringe a little bit when I read it.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
Don't believe he said that...
He may think it, but no head coach talks like that. Except Saban when not considering the Alabama offer the first time around.
Eschew obfuscation.
Tubberville wasn't leaving Ole Miss. Saban wasn't leaving the Dolphins.
Not saying he’d really come here, that Ole Miss will or even should go after him, but I don’t take a coach at his word on these issues without some evidence to back it up. They’re about as honest as Congressmen.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
My understanding is during Charlie's brief coaching stint at Ole Miss (1990, WR coach) was not enjoyable for he and his family
and that he still holds some animosity for that.
Just another "good for nothing law school grad".
by RebelBarrister on Nov 8, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
I don't want Charlie Strong anyway...
he is a WR coach by trade and I think we should do everything we can to keep Brewer. I know that ultimately the coach who comes in will have to make that decision, but he is an “Ole Miss man” (think Michigan) and I don’t want someone telling him how to do his job.
(I don’t believe what coaches say either. They have to look out for themselves.)
I'm a Rebel, but I bleed the cherry and silver of the Lobos.
I thought Strong was a defensive coordinator...
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
strong reaction
It is important to remember Oxford in 1990(strong’s tenure as an assistant) was a VERY different place than the Oxford most of you know today. Rebel flags were still everywhere on campus, game day or not. And the town itself was about half it’s current size. The campus was very out of date with subpar academic AND athletic facilities. It might as well been 40 years ago, compared to what Oxford is like today. Never mind the backwards ass attitude about interracial marriage(his wife is white) that still exsist today throughout the state. Throw in the unrealistic expectations that exsist among fans and administration, and it would appear to be an unattractive opening…oh yeah, having to bang heads with bama/lsu also figures into this mess.
by ghostofbillybrewer on Nov 8, 2011 3:00 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fuck him. who gives a shit about charlie strong anyway
I dont see why anybody would even mention that guy. What the fuck has he done??
I like Smart, but Sumlin looks good as well.
Is Oxford ready for Mike Leach? we have already had one insane head coach here do we need another?
In my body, where the shame gland should be, there is a second awesome gland. True story.
by Duece's accoutant on Nov 8, 2011 1:04 PM EST reply actions
I've actually been reconsidering Sumlin
and reevaluating why I’m so high on Kirbry Smart. I really diidn’t have a great answer. Someone argued above that Smart would probably want to have a Saban offense, which is definitely not what we need in Oxford. An offensive coach with a solid D-coordinator is starting to look like it’s the better direction.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
Are we above FCS coaches?
Willie Fritz has done a great job at Sam Houston State, but then again he is coaching at Sam Houston State. It doesn’t look like he as any SEC connections, but if we are looking for an outsider, then he may be someone to consider, even if only for a coordinating position.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
I'm all for going after a 1-AA coach.
If he was a championship-level coach at that level.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
I voted for Rich Rodriguez.
I do so hesitantly because we have recently been stung by a re-tread, and the history of re-tread’s is marred with examples of depressing mediocrity or, worse, monumental failure (see: Tyrone Willingham, Mike Price, Rick Neuheisel, Bob Toledo). In fact, perhaps, the closest thing to “success” you might be able to tag on a re-tread is the job Ron Zook has done at Illinois (Rose Bowls balance out years of mind-numbing suck). I don’t want to be Illinois.
But I think Rodriguez had a special dose of bad circumstances that got him fired at Michigan. The program was declining talent-wise at the end of Lloyd Carr’s career, and Rodriguez tried to totally upheave the type of football players (and not just at quarterback) that Michigan was going after. Both are true – to some extent – at Ole Miss. But they seemed true after the Orgeron era, as well. The biggest adjustment from Nutt era to Rodriguez era would be, I think, in the skill set of the Offensive Line.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Destroying your traditions since [YEAR REDACTED].
by Ivory Tower on Nov 8, 2011 1:11 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
As long as Rodriguez
wouldn’t try to pull that 3-3-5 bullshit and would get a competent D-coordinator who’s familiar with the SEC, I think that’d be solid.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
This is just my opinion
but I’m not convinced RichRod would be willing to totally take his hands off the defense. I hate to throw this comment out, but I will: I played a college sport (I’m sure others of you did as well). College coaches are some of the most arrogant, stubborn, and delusional people you will ever meet. They are all convinced their system is perfect and they just need better talent to make it work. If RichRod could honestly come in and just hire a great DC and let it go, I’d support his hiring. However, I doubt that would happen. The man flamed out quickly at Michigan and had plenty of people pointing out how bad his defense was. He still went down trying to coach the defense “his way.”
Therein
lies my hesitation with RichRod.
However, hopefully his time analyzing football has also brought about an existential crisis in which he asks himself “Am I a defensive genius?”
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Alright, time to jump in here
Rodriguez never had the kind of support from any group at Michigan (administration, alumni, former players and coaches, etc.) that he deserved. The entire interview and hiring process that brought Rodriguez to Michigan was a mindless clusterfuck, including the athletic director being completely unreachable on a boat in Florida the day that Kirk Herbstreit reported that Les Miles was coming to Michigan. Lloyd Carr signed any and all releases that came his way, which explains the mass exodus of players leading up to Rodriguez’s first season.
To make matters worse, Rodriguez never had his first choice of defensive coordinator, Jeff Casteel. Casteel is the architect behind the respectable (statistically speaking) defenses that Rodriguez had during his best years at West Virginia. Instead, Rodriguez came to Michigan with Scott Schafer, who was fired after the 2008 season. Greg Robinson was the DC in 2009 and 2010, which, yeah.
I could rant all day about how Rodriguez wasn’t given a fair shake at Michigan from the get-go, but the main point is that he’s a lot closer to the coach he was at West Virginia than the guy whose team got blown up by Mississippi State in last year’s Gator Bowl. Yes, Michigan’s defense is worlds better this season with no additions*, other than replacing Greg Robinson with Greg Mattison as defensive coordinator. However, the offense is horrid, save for two-minute drills (which makes sense, considering that’s basically Rodriguez’s normal approach offensively. Denard Robinson has declined considerably, and I don’t think that statistics (other than the INTs) tell the whole story. He is the proverbial Ferrari in the garage under Michigan’s new regime.
*The graduation of Obi Ezeh is largely considered to be addition by subtraction, so having an actual MLB might have something to do with it as well.
So, long story short, if Rodriguez gets a good DC he can do some serious damage at Ole Miss.
Indeed,
watching Robinson’s decline is sickening. He is too much of a talent to try to run a conventional offense.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Rodriguez's choice of DC would be interesting to say the least.
I doubt he could lure Casteel away from West Virginia, but it’s possible he could find someone of a similar mold from his coaching days at either Tulane or Clemson.
Whatever the hire is, it has to be the right one. I think Rodriguez knows that.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe we could get Casteel
Dana Holgerson wants nothing to him. Casteel is the only person left on staff from the Rodriguez/Stewart era and Ollie Luck kept him there because he had been doing well. It still confuses me as to why Casteel didn’t go to Michigan with Rich Rod. But after how Casteel has done this year without his position coaches under him, WVU is ready to drop him and Holgie can’t get that done soon enough. If it was a little safer situation with Rodriguez, I’m sure Jeff would leave Morganhole for God’s country
Casteel didn't go with him to Meecheegan because the UofM administration
didn’t want him to bring Casteel. They wanted him to hire Scott Schafer, who sucks.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think you're correct about that.
Casteel was the only key member of Rodriguez’s staff that Bill Stewart was able to convince to stay at West Virginia. As to why Casteel stayed, it’s a little harder to say. Michigan apparently had a rule about not offering contracts to assistants (which has obviously changed, given Greg Mattison). They offered Casteel $265,000 with no contract. Stewart offered Casteel a little more: $275,000 and a two-year contract. Casteel stayed.
Casteel apparently is less interested in money but more interested in job security and a comfortable situation.
I’m not sure where you’re getting your information that the Michigan administration was against the hiring of Casteel. They still made him an offer.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 6:12 PM EST up reply actions
The contract situation is indeed why Casteel stayed at WVU
But you’re both right. Michigan wanted Schafer as DC (which may be partially why they didn’t offer Casteel a contract after WVU did).
Leach is my top choice
he’s proven that he can when with slightly above average talent. He went 11-2 in ‘08 at TTU and in the Big 10-12, whatever it’s called these days, that’s hard to do if you’re not Texas or Oklahoma. I think he recognizes talent and is disciplinary…just ask Craig James.
- guy would be June Jones. I know he’s not gonna happen but look what he’s done at SMU. He’s bringing them back to life. I won’t mention Hawaii too much but he was highly successful there playing and winning in BCS bowl games. They even beat Boise St. and Alabama during his tenure.
#3. Gus Malzahn. I think he’s creative enough to out smart other coaches and that is needed at Ole Miss. Only thing I question, is if he’s ready to be a HC. He was very successful as a HS coach and that leads me to believe that he’s ready.
I’m against hiring Smart b/c I think Saban and recruiting is to blame for his success at LSU and Bama.
I've moved Leach up from #2 to #1 on my list also.
I’m jumping off of the Smart bandwagon. As far as June Jones goes, I think we know that won’t happen. However, I would love it if we could get Steve Orsini (SMU’s Athletic Director).
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
Steve Orsini would be a great catch
Just look what he did for UCF and what he’s doing for SMU. He’s made a lot of great hires and has raised a lot of $$$ at both schools.
Kevin Sumlin
New around here. Be gentle.
I first read about this idea the other day on RCR. I hadnt heard of it before or even thought about it as a possibility. I’m a hardcore rebs fan (good, bad and ugly). When I first saw this mentioned I just thought “wow! now thats a hell of an idea!”
I’m from H-Town born and raised, spent all my life here except for the 4 years (plus some summers) I was in the oxpatch. I’ve been watching the U of H program pretty closely for the last 5 or 6 years since I came to work at my current company. The owner of my company is a HUUUUUUUGE U of H atheltics supporter (on the board for the new stadium, etc). I have to say, over this time period I have watched Briles and now Sumlin take the U of H program from what most people consider at the level of a high school program equivalent (you know how we like our high skrool foosball over here in Tx) to what I consider a pretty dang good (and consistiently improving) program over the last few years. And they’ve done it with CRAP facilities, CRAP stadium, and I can guarantee not near as much money flowing through the program as is probably flowing through Ole Miss’.
My impressions of Sumlin, he’s VERY media friendly, VERY alumni Savy, and seems to be albe to get the most out of what I would consider some very marginal players (not including Case Keenum in that). Granted, Keenum is a freak of nature at the QB, but Sumlin’s been able to put enough people around him to make them a pretty dang competitive team. I can’t IMAGINE what he might be able to do with some GOOD facilities, BIG money. I’d personally like to see it. Plus, (and here is the key) no players REALLY want to go to U of H. He’s basically done all of this with guys that either werent good enough for the UT’s, A&M’s, or Tech’s. Or werent smart enough to get into Rice, Baylor, TCU, SMU, etc. He (and also Briles) were able to find those diamonds in the rough and has been able to motivate them to play above what they were. That and keep the dumb ones grades good enough to stay on the field.
The big “ut oh” I could see in this scenario and I can’t say this with 100% certainty is I believe his wife is white. Not that I’ve got any problem with it, but I can see that might be a teensy weency issue for some of the “old guard”. That and also he just signed a contract extension through 2015 with U of H, and I’m betting the buy out would be pretty steep.
If it was at all possible, I’d love to see him driving the bus for the rebs though.
It does suck, but I think you're right in that
the whole race issue would be a problem with some people. It sucks that such even bears mentioning, but that’s the world we live in.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Let's not surrender too easily on that.
One great advantage to Sumlin, not mentioned by our new friend from Houston, is that hiring him would throw the last shovel-full of dirt on Colonel Rebel, who finally and fortunately lies mouldering in his grave, whatever Forward Rebels might think to the contrary.
Eschew obfuscation.
"Mouldering"
Sutpens is your fifty dollar word of the day winner.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Destroying your traditions since [YEAR REDACTED].
by Ivory Tower on Nov 8, 2011 2:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Did I mention he's got a pretty decent coaching pedigree too??
He served as an assistant at Washington State, Wyoming, Minnesota, Purdue, served as assistant head coach at Texas A&M for two years, and as offensive coordinator for five years at Oklahoma under Bob Stoops. In addition to Stoops, he has served under R. C. Slocum, Mike Price and Dennis Erickson. In his final year with the Sooners, his offense was one of the best in the country, averaging 44 points per game.3 In December 2009, it was announced that Sumlin was a finalist for the Paul “Bear” Bryant Award.
not a real person
“Not that I’ve got any problem with it”…Knows the words to “John Brown’s Body”…and chooses summer in Oxford over summer in Houston…doesn’t know Keenum was considered a marginal recruit. Not a real Rebel. Not a real Houstonian, A State-grinding troll.
Yeah right. I did my 4 years in Oxford from 88-92 back when there was only Forresters, The Gin and I cant remember the one other freaking bar we had. Shakey Pete cut my damn hair and tried to cut my ear off a few times. Lived in GHM my freshman year and did my other 3 in Bernies bungalos.
Didnt say anywhere that Keenum was a stud recriut. Just said he’s a freak of a QB making the point that he accounts for a lot of Cougar High’s success.
Sumlin (from the little I’ve seen and heard him) I think would be an excellent long-term fit in Oxford. Think whatever you want.
I was only kidding
I understand why some might actually agree, I couldn’t possibly comment.
Right up to the point you said “Cougar High” which, my young Padawan, is a quasi-rascist epithet that goes back to a time, oh, before you were born.
I thought Cougar High
was a new sitcom on NBC where a private school offers Milfs the chance to relive high school.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
I think youre WAY TOO SENSITIVE
It was meant in the same way we refer to certain places as Hardy Street High and Memphis High School.
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 9, 2011 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
Well I have no freaking idea what “John Browns Body” is. I did go to Ole Miss though so I guess you’ll have to cut me some slack.
Slack cut
Truth told, your high school team probably could have beaten UH during the Dana Dimel era. But what do I know, I went to school in SBISD and I’m a snarky SOB
Possibly...
But I’m the one who knows the words to “John Brown’s Body”. No MSU troll would know who John Brown was.
Eschew obfuscation.
One thing I know for certain....
I don’t want someone to come in and try to run the Nick Saban offense in Oxford. I think we absolutely need a disciplined head coach who knows what they’re doing defensively. Heck, I’d roll out the red carpet and hand feed grapes to whatever coach comes in and instills a disciplined/Saban-style defense system. However, as has been said many times already, the Saban offense only works if you get Saban-caliber recruits year after year after year. We aren’t getting that caliber of offensive talent in Oxford now (and may not ever). I am not even sure we have an SEC-caliber QB on the roster right now. I agree with what Ghost and others have said- we need someone who is willing to think outside the box offensively. We have had two straight coaches who ran the pro-style/run-run-pass offense to very little success (unless they had NFL caliber talent at multiple positions like we did in 2008 and 2009).
100% agree.
This is what I’ve been arguing with friends about all morning. I don’t want a junior Nick Saban, because I don’t think they would be successful with average talent. It’s certainly not going to put hot co-ed asses in the seats when the final score is Ole Miss 10 Vandy 7. We need Leach/Rich Rod to light it up and score some serious points and get the fan base excited. We need something different and exciting.
Alright, I'm officially casting my lot
with Kevin Sumlin. Leach would be my second choice, but I think that Sumlin as head coach (and de facto OC) with Tracy Rocker at DC could be a slam-dunk.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 1:43 PM EST reply actions
Leach.
I’ve been a fan of the Pirate since he whooped our asses with Eli. Felt like he should have been on our list after Cutt and instead of Nutt.
I’m kind of intrigued by RichRod more than I would have suspected. Not a fan of retreads, but seems interesting – not a fan of how that went down at WV and he went to a bad deal at Michigan. I could be sold. Apparent ties to Manning?
tripleB.tumblr.com // msbeernut.com
My own view...
is that Mike Leach or RichRod would never be recommended by Archie Manning. No lightning rods or richrods need apply. As for the latter, I hope to God my uninformed speculation is right. I could live with Leach but would prefer not to. One insane coach per decade is enough for me.
Many of the comments seem to suggest that we ought to hire a coach who fits with our present scheme/athletes. I couldn’t disagree more. If the next Tim Tebow were already wearing red and blue, I might feel differently. But since he’s not, we need to build for the future. We need relative youth, energy, enthusiasm and (football) brains. That suggests to me that we need “hungry” as in talented youngish coordinator who wants to prove something on the next rung up, and who has the ability to do it.
We also need to be realistic. Jon Gruden or the equivalent is not coming to Oxford to work under a dysfunctional administration at the second smallest school in the SEC with, by conference standards, bottom tier resources — and yet somehow perform a miraculous resurrection to return Ole Miss to its “rightful” place alongside LSU and Alabama. It’s just not going to happen.
But Kirby Smart or someone like him might come to Oxford to begin what is going to be a long rebuilding process.
Eschew obfuscation.
Great post Sutpen
I agree, especially with the “one insane coach per decade” comment. And, we must be realistic. We need to make a statement that we’re serious, but we must live in reality were money is concerned. It has always been thus.
The Manning Network
Archie as AD Peyton to coach. “The Manning Network” Courtesy of Ole Miss
That's absurd.
Let’s take a guy with no experience as an athletics administrator and a guy with no coaching experience and have them lead our program all because their last names happen to be “Manning.” That’s a recipe for disaster.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 2:08 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not being rough. I'm giving my honest opinion of your suggestion.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions
Honestly...
Smart or Diaz, or another defensive minded coach would be best for us. Leach seems to be the popular choice but I am not sold on him. Gonna be a long road ahead to get that system working in Oxford… The top teams in the SEC always have a cut throught defense and a ground and pound offense. Seems to be a recipe for WINNING…
The issue
is that we don’t have the personnel, or the access to said personnel, to run Saban’s system. We won’t pull in 5 star lineman year in and year out. We need to have an offense that can make up for our defensive deficiencies because we can’t just shut everyone down right now. Saban’s system is built to not lose games. We don’t have the defense capabilities to play like that.
Not to mention, Auburn from last season and the Florida teams of several years ago were spread teams that were able to run. One of the reasons that the spread is so effective these days is that it gets speed in space and can compensate for a deficiency in the running game. Even if you can’t match up on the line, finding receivers in space quickly creates yards. However, with Saban’s system, if you can’t run, you can’t win.
Moreover, I think Leach’s transition would be quick and painless. We’re already running over half our plays out of spread formations and are loaded for the next three years at wide out. We just have to accept that we won’t be able to run the program in the same way Alabama can. That’s why I think we need to go after a Leach, Sumlin, etc. to give us a fighting chance.
And while people give Leach hell for not being able to beat Ole Miss in 08, that defense was unbelievable and Leach’s team still put up 34 points in the loss (without Michael Crabtree). Even Tim Tebow couldn’t do that.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
Couldn't have said it better myself...
Tough defense and ground and pound offense is a recipe for winning if you routinely have top 5 recruiting classes and are coached by Nick Saban. We meet neither of those criteria.
Also, I agree it makes no sense for people to not want to hire Leach because he lost to Nutt in the 2008 Cotton Bowl. We were a legitimate top 7-8 team in the country at that point in the season and had about 10-11 guys on the field that day who are currently playing legit minutes in the NFL. Leach’s team was w/o Crabtree and, to be honest, seemed disinterested in playing in that game since their BCS title game dreams had fallen apart. How many of TTU’s players in that game are currently on NFL rosters? Crabtree I know, I can’t think of anyone else off the top of my head.
Then why do people keep mentioning how Leach beat Ole Miss twice in '02 and '03?
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Familiarity's sake
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
Not to mention, Auburn from last season and the Florida teams of several years ago were spread teams that were able to run.
I agree with a lot of what you say but, to be fair, the Auburn and Florida teams you referenced featured the best two (offensive) college football players since at least (and probably) including Peyton Manning.
Eschew obfuscation.
All good points
I agree in regards to the talent it takes to run a Saban defense. We had some serious talent Nutts first 2 years. A little help from him and we could have been stout.
As far as us beating Leach or him beating us is irrelevant…on any given Saturday (or New Years day)…
We need a surge on both sides of the ball bottom line. Whatever we do, both sides of the ball need to compliment each other. I think if Nutt would have played his cards right, having the biggest OL in NCAA, we could ground and pound with Bolden and Davis. The defense is a different story… We are in desperate need for an identity… Whoever we get needs to plant that seed in the locker room. We are at a cross road right now and we need some direction. Here’s to a new bright future in Oxford for years to come.
C'mon
Payton has been an NFL OC for 5 or 6 years now.
by Operation_Masoli_Freedom on Nov 9, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Leach
We either need a bad ass offense like Arkansas or bad ass defenses like Alabama or LS **WHO, with the players we currently have it would be much easier to have a bad ass offense, it would be like having Eli again, you will score on us but we will score more.
You all mean the same Leach
Who’s ass we tore up in the Cotton Bowl a couple of years ago??
The problem with the Pirate’s O is when the bump up against a well coached D they get smoked. Just like all the other chuck and duck teams do. That weak crap may fly in the Big 12 (or 10 or 9 or whatever the hell they are going to call it now) or the PAC 10, but aginst the D’s in the SEC your gonna need a whole lot of back up QB’s.
It's been pointed out on recent threads,
but losing a game to a particular coach should not qualify them as poor coaches. Would you like Les Miles to be your head coach? Because he lost to Nutt three consecutive seasons.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
Not saying that. I’m saying in general the spread type offenses do poorly aginst well coached smash mouth defences except in cases like Oregon where they just flat wear them out due to poor conditioning. If you’ve got an O that can grind it out on the ground and eat clock though and give your D a chance to rest you can still usually win that game which I think has been proven when these types of team meet in the bowls.
Again,
we don’t have the personnel to grind the clock. That starts with the offensive line. Look at Alabama and LSU’s offensive line’s recruiting stats. They both average over 4 stars at each spot on the O-line. We’ve had maybe three lineman in the past five years that could have started for Alabama or LSU. We do not have the lineman to physically grind it out against quality defenses nor does Mississippi produce enough quality offensive lineman to fill that role.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
I don' think you understand how Leach's system utilizes average talent...
Their offensive system requires significantly less out of the offensive line than a ground-and-pound game.
That’s why their offensive line has such huge splits between them (If they’re in the middle of the field, their line would often go from hashmark to hashmark). They fill up space to give the QB 2-5 seconds to get rid of the ball. How would that be less effective than trying to use average lineman to push Marcel Dareuses and such off the ball? We haven’t been able to run a “ground-and-pound” offense at any point in Nutt’s tenure against quality defensive fronts. Even in 2008 and 09, Alabama’s defense shut our running game down.
If Alabama, with all their size and talent, couldn’t blow LSU off the ball consistently, what makes you think we’d get the talent here that could ever do that to the top 2 or 3 defensive lines in the SEC? My entire point is that Ole Miss will not be able to run a Saban-esque system because we have neither the resources or recruits to pull it off. Talk to any offensive lineman and ask them if they’d rather hold a pass block for three seconds or try to blow Nick Fairly off the ball down after down.
The point I’m making is that Leach’s system compensates for a lack in talent. A mediocre offensive line is much less likely to give up a sack if the defensive players have to get past them and run 10 yards to the quarterback in 3 seconds instead of being able to stack the box against smaller, inferior lineman that rely on slow-developing runs and play action. When our quarterback has to fake a handoff, roll out of the pocket and find an open receiver, that takes alot longer to get the throw off.
If you think we’ll be able to overpower Alabama or LSU’s defensive lines any time soon, you’re delusional. I do worry about Leach’s offenses’ ability to score inside the 5, but considering that we can’t even get inside the red-zone, I’ll worry about that day when it comes.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
I get your point, but I dont know, I just think with the speed and strength of the D’s in the SEC you better have a damn quick QB and recieving corp with FLAWLESS exectuion or your QB “is going to go down and go down hard” A LOT, and you better have a few extras to back him up.
Can it be done. Yep. Can it be done in Oxford against D’s like Bama, LSU, et al. I’m not so sure. The teams you see with the most success in the spread dont play D’s like we do in the SEC until they get to the bowl games. Then its ususally lights out against the top tier teams.
I'm not sure this will work either.
Has Leach ever really done well against teams with good SEC defenses (no, Ole Miss in ‘02 and ’03 don’t count)? Heck his teams didn’t do well against Oklahoma’s defenses most of the time and they were questionable defenses.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
I just think
a pass-happy offense evens the playing field. If your measure of success is how good an offense performs against an LSU/Alabama caliber defense, then we’d be terrible regardless. However, we actually have the data: it’s hard as shit to run against Bama and LSU.
However, WVU and Oregon had a chance through most of that game and threw for over 400 yards. They just couldn’t stop LSU’s running game. In last year’s national championship, Oregon’s running game was shut down by Nick Fairly. Oregon still managed to keep the game close by throwing for over 350 yards.
A wide-open offense at least gives us the chance to erase deficits and force the defense to keep working. If we go down 14-0 to Bama or LSU, would you rather have a ball-control offense or one that can actually score?
How would running a traditional run-run-pass offense be more effective against an Alabama or LSU? Sure we’d eat up some clock if we managed to get a first down, but more than likely, we’d spend the game watching our QB run for his life on 3rd and 9 because we couldn’t manage more than one or two yards rushing on the early downs.
Spread offenses will get the ball into player’s hands in space. A grind it out offense will let teams stack the box and force us into conventional passing downs, where the good teams will blitz the shit outta us. I will take Nick Brassell vs. Dre Kirkpatrick over Bradley Sowell vs. Marcel Dareus 10 times out of 10. One mistake by a skill position player on defense can lead to a touchdown. One mistake by a defensive lineman may result in an 8 yard gain.
Defenses traditionally dominate bowl games. They have a month to watch tape and prepare for the opposing offense. Oregon held Auburn to 22 points in the national championship. Even Alabama couldn’t do that. Do you really think Oregon’s D last year was better than Bama’s?
So, to sum it up: A Mike Leach offense with a quality defensive coordinator would easily be the best route to take. We need to win and win quickly with lesser talent. I’m not concerned with beating LSU and Bama right now. We need to try to beat Kentucky, Vandy, State, and then Georgia, Auburn, Arkansas and South Carolina. A run-oriented offense would not roll over those middle tier teams. A pass oriented attack though, well it gives us more of a chance than three yards and a cloud of dust.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
since I hate yall, do not listen to this man
he makes terrible sense.
do everything in your power to emulate Saban. there’s no other path to success but 3 yards and a cloud of dust.
nemo me impune lacessit
I don't want to emulate Saban...
I just want to beat him once every 5 or 6 years. That makes Les Miles my No. 1 Unavailable Unrealistic Choice. Besides, he’s already won one game for Ole Miss.
Eschew obfuscation.
Which proves the point
that Nutt’s biggest failure was in recruiting. His attrition numbers alone show that he was targeting way too many of the wrong guys. You don’t have to have an O line made up exclusively of 4* and 5* recruits, but you do have to have lineman who can get into school, stay in school, make grades and quit smoking ganja.
I repeat: It would be a grave mistake to recruit a head coach to mesh with the talent presently on campus. The new coach will need to know how to most effectively use that talent, but unless this is going to be another 3-4 year hire, he better be able to identify and recruit the kind of athletes that will prosper in the coach’s own system.
Eschew obfuscation.
Have faith
With our Receivers and Jeff Scott an “Air Raid” offense would slow down those big D-lineman, I’m just not a fan of the RichRod speed options and so forth that was proven in the LSU Oregon game as well as the Auburn Oregon game that will not work in the SEC. Hire Leach and have him recruit a BIG time QB and give him about 3 to 5 seconds to hit our receivers and the defense will be chasing behind us to the end zone.
What about when West Virginia beat Georgia in the Sugar Bowl five years ago?
Remember that Rich Rod offense defeating the SEC Champions?
I know, I know, one game sample size and all, but I think the idea that a spread or spread-option attack relying primarily on speed, misdirection, and space can’t win in the SEC isn’t really supported by any sort of legitimate precedent.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:32 PM EST up reply actions
Most of these arguments relating to what will or won't work in the SEC
are rooted in the myth that there is a very specific style of football played in the SEC. That’s just not true. We’ve seen plenty of teams through the years that ran more open offenses (Kentucky under Mumme, Florida under Meyer.) We’ve seen teams from other conferences beat the supposedly superior SEC defenses in OOC and bowl games (Utah over Bama, Boise over Georgia, the aforementioned WVU over Georgia). The fact is, we like to toot our own horn and talk about SEC defenses and how we’re these tough grind-it-out guys, but for the most part that’s not true. Part of the reason that the SEC is the dominant conference in college football is because it adapts to the game at a much more rapid pace than the competition. There will always be three yard and a cloud of dust teams, and there will always be defense first teams, but to say that that is the only way to win in the SEC is ludicrous. Arkansas has proven otherwise for the last two years.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 6:39 PM EST up reply actions
Read above
It doesn’t seem like Arkansas is having trouble scoring points against those defenses you talk about. I would take Arkansas record the last two years over where we have been. But if you don’t think an offense liek that will work, lets get someone who will run it up the middle on 1st and 2nd down and then throw on 3rd and long all effing game. Oh wait we just had that.
by RufusFrenchForHeisman on Nov 8, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Precisely
An air-raid offense gives us a chance to match our athletes with the opposition. Against the LSUs and Bamas of the world, we will never stand a chance with a ball-control offense. They’re just better at that. But if you are able to score on any given play, that changes the context of a game.
With Nutt’s conservative philosophy, a 14-point deficit is nearly insurmountable.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
Call Archie
Someone go to Toys R Us and get the Biggest Pirate Ship playground cause we’ve got a coach to hire
by Totty Hoddy on Nov 8, 2011 2:04 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I'd take Manny Diaz...
only if we’re talking about the tennis coach at Georgia. That guy knows how to win.
I get crunk 25 days a week!
by 25 Days a Week on Nov 8, 2011 2:11 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Mobile phone rec.
Does not greenify. :(
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Destroying your traditions since [YEAR REDACTED].
by Ivory Tower on Nov 8, 2011 4:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Big news from the Forward Together Campaign:
Instead of bowling in the North End Zone, they’ve decided to remove the bleachers and put one of these in
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 2:12 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
Cool
Take all the old rides from Libertyland and Opryland USA and move them to VHS.
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 9, 2011 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
The Pippin is in Green Bay right now.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Rich Rodriguez
is the best option. I voted for him because in my opinion he’s the best overall coach, would work nicely with the personnel (Mackey, receivers, etc.), and has a rapport with Archie Manning. Seems like the most likely to get the job.
That said, obviously Rodriguez will have to answer the big question: defense. Nobody in their right mind would hire him without asking who his DC is going to be.
Like any coach, Rodriguez has some issues. The biggest one is that he’s painfully stubborn, although that seems to come with the territory. The 3-3-5 is ineffective against the power-running game in the Big Ten (especially the I-form), but I’m not convinced it couldn’t work in the SEC. Rodriguez either needs to find someone who is a whiz at the 3-3-5 (a la Jeff Casteel), or hire a kick-ass defensive coordinator and let the guy run the defense.
I just don't think
you can win in the SEC with 6 man fronts.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
one sight prob with Dick Rod.
he has no loyalty! He bounced WVU after saying he would come back and after convincing Pat White to not enter the NFL draft….AND HE PLAYED FB THERE!!! Imagine what he would do with us after he had a good year or two.
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
He had a list of "demands," for lack of a better word
that weren’t met by the WVU athletic department after they had already said that they would be (so there’s your loyalty right there). The list was fairly reasonable, asking for things such as increased wages for his assistants, upgraded facilities, etc. and did not include anything regarding increased pay for himself. Basically, he wanted to be there, but the higher-ups at WVU weren’t really showing reciprocal feelings, so he left.
Have to agree with handsomerob
The WVU brass felt Rodriguez was getting too much influence, and then he started asking for the basic ingredients that all the best programs have: facilities, stability with assistant coaches, jet for recruiting, and an academic adviser to make sure the kids were on the path to graduate. Hardly seems like a “Dick” move.
I can understand that WVU didn’t want to commit any more money to football, but that’s exactly what Rodriguez was asking, so that’s why they conflicted. The Michigan job came up and, originally, Rodriguez didn’t want to leave West Virgina. He thought he could use the Michigan offer as an ace in his pocket to get the WVU brass to improve the program. Instead, WVU didn’t budge, and Rodriguez left for Michigan, because they were offering everything he wanted at WVU (upgraded facilities, better pay for assistants, etc.)
Don’t forget, he also turned down the Alabama job. But that was when he thought he and WVU wanted the same things.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 3:25 PM EST up reply actions
If this is the case, Rich Rod and Ole Miss probably aren't gonna work out.
Ole Miss lost Tuberville for the same reasons back in ‘98, and though there is a little better support than what he got, there are still a lot of stubborn people at Ole Miss who don’t want to do things any differently and certainly aren’t going to let the coach tell them how things need to work.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
At some point, any coach worth his salt is going to make those demands.
Rich Rod was just the first guy at West Virginia to do so—hence the clash and eventual departure.
If Ole Miss really wants to move forward, any (good) coach they hire is going to say “If you want to be like Alabama, this is what we have to do.”
But maybe you’re right. Maybe Ole Miss isn’t ready for that.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
In all honesty
I’d be willing to bet that some of these demands would need to be met before Rodriguez agrees to come to Ole Miss. From what I’ve read here, it sounds like the facilities are already top notch, so there’s one off the list. Money for assistants and various recruiting resources were his other two big beefs with WVU.
Boone
That’s because Pete boone was the AD and his ass is on the way out my friend. Bring someone in who isn’t going to make assistant coaches drive up to recruits houses in a Ford Fusion to save a coupel dollars.
by RufusFrenchForHeisman on Nov 8, 2011 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
Boone is far from the only Ole Miss person with old ways of thinking holding Ole Miss back.
He’s a product of the system more than a cause of it. That said, I hope you’re right Boone being gone will change things.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Rich Rod won the Sugar Bowl at WVU.
I guaran-damn-tee if an Ole Miss coach wins the Sugar Bowl he’ll get whatever the Hell he wants in spades.
“Four more IPFs?! SURE!”
“Unlimited meatloaf from Ajax?! YOU GOT IT, COACH!”
“A canal connecting the practice fields to Sardis so that you can take a yacht to and fro?! FIND ME MY CHECKBOOK AND MY ROLODEX!”
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:49 PM EST up reply actions
Unlimited meatloaf from Ajax
I hope to someday be worthy of that honor.
"There's no better way to say 'I'm a badass' than the thumbs up. It's so hot right now."
I'm sorry but despite our problems, Ole Miss is a lifetime ahead of where we were
when Tubby was in Oxford. We’ve added pretty much everything Tubby was asking for and then some. And that’s not counting the recently announced $150 million capital campaign that will result in expanding and renovating the stadium again. Throw in the fact that we’ve gone from having one of the lowest coaching salaries in D-I to paying Nutt an annual salary good enough for top 15 nationally.
I say all of that to say….you’re comment would have been accurate in 1998.
You are incorrect on the list of things Rich wanted from WVU
He wanted: a sideline pass for his wife, the players to be able to sell their textbooks they were given as part of their scholarships for cash, a greater alotment of tickets for high school coaches, and his own personal subscription website like the one Dennis Franchione had at the time at Texas A&M.
WVU told him they had to investigate whether selling textbooks and operating a subscription website were allowed by the NCAA. Rich didn’t want to have to wait for that.
He alleged that a new locker room promised in his 2006 contract, negotiated during the Alabama flirtation, was not going to be built, when in fact ground was to be broken for said locker room following the Fiesta Bowl because it couldn’t be renovated during the season. Rich didn’t want to wait for that.
He asked for raises for his assistants, but WVU refused because they had given the assistants raises the year before, and it didn’t want to be in a situation where Rich would threaten to leave every single year if he didn’t get exactly what he wanted when he wanted it without the AD doing due diligence.
It was completely a matter of power. Rich Rod wanted absolute unquestioned power. The administration wanted oversight. It was a petty needless power struggle, not a matter of WVU not being willing to buy a jet (that’s flat wrong).
Personally, I would have prefered for WVU to give him what he wanted.
From my understanding
RR had to raise the funds for the jet himself (via the 1100 club). I could be wrong on this, but the WVU brass didn’t see the value in a private jet—whereas RR saw it as a crucial recruiting tool (i.e. to recruit nationally).
You are correct that we didn’t include every item on the list, including a sideline pass for his wife, the ability to sell textbooks (which is legal), more access for high school coaches, and an athletics website.
I think it often gets misunderstood that RR was up to something sinister—again, I could be wrong about this—when all he really wanted was the WVU program to have what all the elite programs had. At first he didn’t want to go to Michigan; he wanted to lead WVU to its first national championship. My main point is that had WVU simply given him everything that Michigan was offering, he would have easily stayed.
by Meager Reader on Nov 9, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
That sounds far too familiar like what we did to
Tommy Tuberville in 1997. He wanted a few things, we wouldn’t give them to him, so he went somewhere that would – Auburn.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
Well, then we'd have a good year and
something to build off of for the next guy. I’m okay with someone using Ole Miss as a stepping stone insomuch that, were they to do that, they’d have to leave the program in much better shape than they’re getting it.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:45 PM EST up reply actions
Leach
If we hire Leach, be sure to let the janitor remove all of the locks on the closets or atleast hide a key in their for our boys
All I got to say is, they better make damn sure they have an awesome D Co to back him up and get a MONSTER O line to protect whatever poor soul he cons into being the QB.
The Problem is
We already have a MONSTER O-line, they just can’t protect anyone
Or we should just tell Craig James and his whiny kids to
fuck off.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:50 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I think we should take a huge risk and hire co-coaches.
This is not an original idea. I’ll let the originator claim it if he wants.
With 3 million to the head coach and 1.5 million each to the coordinators, I think we should hire an OC and a DC. Give one the veto power in necessary situations, i.e. not when we are clearly on offense or defense, and pay them 3.5 and 2.5 million.
In that scenario, I think it would be sweet to have Manny Diaz and Mike Leech or Rocker and Malzahn.
That’s far-fetched, I know. I just wanted to throw it out there.
The one thing we need to understand above all else is that we need a system. I don’t care if it is Saban’s or not, but we need someone who is going to come in and say, we are going to build this way and it is going to affect our daily preparations, our schemes, our recruiting, our media relations…etc.
The second thing is that, we really need someone who cares about recruiting and developing QB talent.
The third, as I said before, Brewer needs to be here. Those kids are studs and they continue to get better.
I'm a Rebel, but I bleed the cherry and silver of the Lobos.
If you want to win...
take Mike Leach.
Right now Ole Miss is in a multi decade slump, and it’s going to take someone extraordinary to pull out of it considering the level that many of the West teams are playing at right now. If Rich Rodriguez couldn’t win at Michigan, I’m not sure how he’d win at Ole Miss without just tripping over the next Pat White and Steve Slaton. The rest of the list is extremely risky.
Texas Tech was in the same boat as Ole Miss is when they hired him, and he came thisclose to getting in the BCS Title Game.
I think it will be difficult
but the cupboard’s not bare by any standards, especially at wide receiver. If Leach could find a quarterback to deliver the ball into the playmakers hands, I think we’d be competitive right away. When he came to Oklahoma in 1999, he improved their offensive ranking 100 spots. Seriously.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
I firmly believe that Rich Rod was given a terrible situation at Michigan.
He came in amid a manufactured controversy surrounding his departure at WVU; saw a whole host of Carr’s players quit, leaving him a bare cupboard; was up against a press corps which didn’t like him from the get go (the Detroit Free Press stacked the deck of public opinion against Rich Rod from day 1); and wasn’t a “Michigan Man,” meaning that fans were baselessly skeptical of him.
The guy won a mere three games in year one. It was the worst year EVER for Michigan football. Then, in year two, he won five games. In year three, he won seven games and went bowling. Now, with HIS offensive line and skill players (and a defensive coordinator that isn’t Greg Robinson – something that Rich Rod also DID NOT want at Michigan), the Wolverines are ranked, have won 7 games, and are likely to finish 8-4 or 9-3 with a decent bowl berth.
Superficially, it seems that Rich Rod built that team from scratch. He wasn’t given enough time or control by the administration to show that he could, in fact, make Michigan a competitive program in the B1G once again.
But, hey, you could be 100% right. There’s a legit chance he could be entirely overrated based on what he did in the Big East and in CUSA. It has happened before when a coach from a smaller conference goes big time. Dan Hawkins from Boise to Colorado is the best example of that I can think of.
[Typed hastily. Forgive grammar and punctuation slipups.]
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
Rodriguez was thrown to the wolves from day one
This was Bill Martin’s (Michigan’s AD at the time) first coaching search and hire, and he basically screwed up so bad that the president of the university got involved. The whole WVU departure and subsequent lawsuit got so bad because Rodriguez’s and Michigan’s attorneys told Rodriguez not to talk about it, allowing WVU to trash him unnecessarily in the media with no defense. Then, Rodriguez was given essentially zero support from the athletic department, and the local media had their way with him the entire time he was in Ann Arbor.
Had Rodriguez gotten the support from the athletic department that Brady Hoke got when he was hired last winter, I fully believe that he (Rodriguez) would still be coaching at Michigan today.
Can we talk less about Rodriguez's situation at Michigan and more about Rodriguez's (potential) situation at Ole Miss?
Thanks.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
Since the big knock on Rodriguez seems to be his unsuccessful stint at Michigan
I’d say the situation there is pretty relevant to the discussion of him as a potential coach at Ole Miss. I’ve seen plenty of people put forward the “If he couldn’t win at Michigan he can’t win at Ole Miss” line of thinking. By actually looking at the facts and circumstances of his employment in Ann Arbor, we can see the context of those unsuccessful years.
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 7:07 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not saying it's not relevant
I just don’t want this to turn into another discussion about what Rodriguez did/did not do at Michigan or what he could have done differently or how it could have turned out differently. The fact is it’s over. Rodriguez and Michigan are done.
Here’s the takeaway and what’s relevant to Ole Miss: the personnel could fit Rodriguez’s system well. Imagine what Rodriguez could do with Anthony Alford.
If you think the Leach hire would turn heads and “put asses in seats,” Rodriguez would practically guarantee it. Instant recognition and notoriety.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 8:33 PM EST up reply actions
Not to mention Randall Mackey
could fit nicely with Rodriguez’s offense.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 8:40 PM EST up reply actions
What the hell is wrong with you?
I’m not quite sure why you have a problem with a Michigan fan coming here to provide insight into one of our potential candidate’s last gig. I welcome it.
FINE! GOD!!
I don’t have a problem with anybody on here. I just wanted to keep the topic on Ole Miss and not on Michigan. Fine, if you want this to divulge into a discussion about Rich Rod and Michigan, I can do that too. I certainly have an opinion on it.
Michigan fans, your insight is appreciated.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
Whomever we hire
We MUST get better in recruiting, Alabama and LSU and now Auburn are always up there and the rest of us are in the lower levels, regardless of who we hire we have got to get someone who can get some of those 5 star players away from those top schools or we’ll always be playing for 3 or worse in our division
Look, lets be serious. Unless said 5 star recruit was born screaming Hotty Toddy when he came out of momma he isnt coming to Oxford to play ball. We need someone that can take a 3 and the few 4 stars we are lucky enough to get and either coach them or motivate them to play better than they are. End of story. We’ll hopefully have “flash in the pan” years once every decade. Thats all we should expect at a school in the middle of nowhere, with less than 20,000 students.
And just a little bit of continuity in the coach area would be nice too.
Very True, hibal
wish more OM fans would realize that. I also think that the university should invest much, much more of the budget into our fb program. If OM can’t beat them on the field, they should be able to at least go toe to toe in our facilities. I think state of the art facilities could lure some big recruits. I’m fine with being 7-5 as long as we look good and beat state doing it.
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
We actually have
some of the best football facilities in the nation.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
I agree
but I’ve seen a lot of other programs(not in person) and I think they’re miles ahead of us. Bama, Florida, Oregon, Texas, both OSU’s…etc. I think we’re doing good with the indoor practice facility and that’s a big plus. If I had to rank us, roughly I’d say we’re probably somewhere in the top 25-45.
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
Considering our funding
we’re getting pretty good bang-for-the-buck.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:41 PM EST up reply actions
No doubt.
If I remember correctly, someone told me OM has the 10th smallest football budget in the SEC. So considering that, hell yeah we’re doing good with our dollars
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:47 PM EST up reply actions
Facilities are nice.
But they don’t win a damn thing. Florida has no indoor practice facility. Let that sink in a minute. Get a winning team and you’ll get fan interest up and then you can build nice shiny facilities.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Florida is also in paradise and doesn't need an indoor practice facility.
Facilities are more or less subjective when it comes to recruits. They’re a bigger deal with coaches. They can be a good recruiting tool—but again, that depends on the recruit.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think working outside in 95 degree heat and thunderstorms every other day during summer practice is paradise for football.
I’m not knocking the indoor practice facility. I’m glad Ole Miss got it. I’ve been inside it and it’s pretty amazing. My problem is it seems like people think it, or other great shiny facilities, are going to turn Ole Miss around.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
just look at what Oregon has done.
In the late 90’s they began outspending their Pac-12(10 back then) foes on an average of 10-1 on their football facilities. Look at them now…they’re loaded with talent
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
facilties don't win games...they lure recruits and keep coaches
and just say we build up fan interest….we’re still in MS, located an hour and a half from MS State…do you think we’re gonna say a ton more tickets then we already are?
by TD's and Beer on Nov 8, 2011 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
Ding Ding Ding Ding.
Winna Winna Chicken Dinna.
But what UM has that State doesnt so much (and for the record I’m completely pulling this out of my rear) is Out of State Alumni. And a crapload of them. I cant tell you how many Ole Miss sitckers I see on cars around Houston and Dallas.
But when you get down to it, its Oxford, MS. Not the number 1 destination for any recruit as I said earlier.
Hell, I see as many Ole Miss stickers in DC as I do
Alabama, Georgia, and Florida. And I certainly believe there are more Ole Miss alumni here than Tennessee, LSU, Arkansas, State, Vanderbilt, and Kentucky.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
I lived in DC
And saw a lot more Tennessee and Kentucky stickers than Ole Miss. LSU stickers out numbered us 6-1. It was hard finding any Ole Miss stuff at all there and God help you if you traveled thru certain sections of town with a Mississippi cartag.
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 9, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah that must've been 20 years ago.
I hardly see Tennessee or Kentucky stickers. As far as SEC schools go, here’s what I see in what order:
1. Florida
2. Georgia
3. Bama
4. Ole Miss
5. Vanderbilt
6. Everybody else
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
Later
471 years in the Future
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 10, 2011 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
Ah yes.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 11, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
well, you can catch Auburn
it involves cash, iphones and coaches named Trooper wearing caps backwards and lots of towel waving. I’m pretty sure yall have more sense than this.
nemo me impune lacessit
Someone somewhere else suggested we hire Trooper Taylor.
I hope that person wasn’t being serious.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 5:03 PM EST up reply actions
And they love to show his stupid ass on Auburn's jumbotron
Made me want to puke throughout that game. Well…that and the game itself.
This is a coach I can get behind
In my body, where the shame gland should be, there is a second awesome gland. True story.
by Duece's accoutant on Nov 8, 2011 2:57 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I like the idea of Leach at head coach, I think we need that excitement in the program, but I honestly don’t see Archie meshing well with him.
I’m becoming more and more a fan of Kevin Sumlin. And HELL NO to Manny Diaz, the last thing we need is someone with ties to sTaYyYyYyT
as for Archie
go ahead and be like Michigan and let a Lloyd Carr type figure torpedo your coaching search. Look how great Michigan is doing?! They’re almost back! And last year? They were almost back then too!
nemo me impune lacessit
I voted Leach.
I think Smart could end up being the best head coach out of the choices one day, but I think Leach would put us in the best position to win over the next few years.
When you hire a coordinator, it’s a huge crapshoot whether they can put together a good staff, be THE guy in charge, and still be successful. It usually takes guys a couple of years to get it figured out.
Granted, Leach isn’t coaching right now so he’d also have to create a staff from scratch, but we know his offense and his system can work with him as the head guy.
Well...
His D.C. at Tech when we blasted them in the Cotton Bowl is currently the head coach at ECU…and about to be unemployed.
Eschew obfuscation.
I know...
that there are some happy people in Red Cup Nation this week! Congrats on ousting Nutt and Boone! The vox populi have spoken and have been rewarded for their deserved protest!
I think Kirby Smart or Charlie Strong would fit nicely!
Oh yeah, Go Dawgz, the real ones!
Are you people Crazy or do you just hate Ole Miss?
There is only one logical person to hire as the new head coach at Ole Miss
Kent Austin
His loyalty to the rebels is unquestioned. He is a proven winner having taken the Roughriders to the Grey Cup and is proving today what a high calibre coach he is at Cornell.
Let’s quit trying throw aways like Mike Leach.
by MorschMorscheimer on Nov 8, 2011 3:44 PM EST reply actions
Surely this is tongue-in-cheek
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
No point in even going here...
Austin is not an option for family reasons alone.
Great Rebel.
Leave it at that
Y'all ponder on this
I have heard from someone close to Archie he is talking to a couple of former pro coaches before they interview anyone, just to see if they would be interested.
That makes sense
because of Archie’s connections in the pros. I wouldn’t be surprised.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
Jeff Fisher would be awesome...
..of course he can have any NFL job he wants so I know its a dream.
by ultimaterebfan on Nov 8, 2011 4:37 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Cowher isn't doing anything much either
He could be yelling and spraying it all over Vaught Hemmingway
If anything, they can give him advice or some other people to talk to.
This is why having Archie involved in this is so valuable. The man has connections that make Trent Lott say “well hot dayum son!”
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 5:05 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Coach Search
It seams the same names are being tossed about whether they be individuals that have held HC jobs or up and coming coordinators.
Arguments can be made for many, some stronger than others. I have my preferences as does everyone else…but I hope we can all agree that having a committee with Archie as a key leader is a good thing.
Archie knows football inside and out on various levels. He is respected and has tons of contacts. I think he will provide valuable insight and leadership if the powers that be truly listen. Look at the Manning’s assessment of the Chargers’ and Giants’ organizations when Eli was going pro. I think time has proven their views on those organizations was correct.
Amen
At least it won’t be Boone looking thru the coaching want ads like the previous years
I love how Eli has done nothing but prove his haters wrong.
“New York will keep sucking and San Diego will be so awesome.” LOLWUT?
“You’ll never win a Super Bowl.” Check.
“You think you can beat Tom Brady?! Pssshhh you’re crazy.” How do you like me now?
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 8, 2011 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
Amen-II
Nearly all of the coaches being mentioned in this thread are has-beens, wash-ups, dumb-asses, and butt-pirates. No one here seems to think Ole Miss is capable of landing a top-tier coach, which is absurd. Ole Miss and Oxford have more pride, passion, culture, and cocktails on a Saturday afternoon than any school west of the Mississippi (or north of the Mason-Dixon) will ever have. Any coach with kids would appreciate the sense of community Oxford has to offer, and every coach’s wife could do worse than shopping on the square. And while we have high aspirations for our football team, which is expected in the SEC, we are considerably more forgiving and complacent than our counterparts in Baton Rouge, Tuscaloosa, and Gainesville. Moreover, a skilled competitor enjoys a challenge, and competing in the SEC West offers precisely that. In short, a coach would have to be off his rocker to turn down this opportunity, and I trust that Archie and the search committee will make this clear as they recruit a new face for our football program.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
Who would we be able to get
that hasn’t been discussed? With the Penn State job opening up, we’ll have to temper expectations a bit. We’re not going to get Chris Petersen or Gary Patterson, but I don’t see how a Kevin Sumlin or talented coordinator type hire would be something to look down at.
I think too often we view the SEC through a rose-colored lense. While Oxford seems awesome to us, there are plenty of coaches who would prefer that the largest city near them not be Memphis. There are a lot of coaches with preconceived notions about Mississippi or who don’t want to live in the deep south, there are a lot who would rather go to Penn State and build upon a successful program than have to revive one in the SEC W via games against Arkansas, Auburn, Alabama and LSU. I think if we want to get a big-time coach, our program has to be on the up-and-up before that happens.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 9:40 AM EST up reply actions
Quitters Never Win/Diamond in the Rough
These are precisely the sentiments that are not going to help us. The same generalizations you make about “a lot of coaches” could apply to any school or region: Why would someone want to coach at Michigan given that the closest city is Detroit? Why would someone want to coach at Arizona State or USC given that region’s problem with human and narcotics trafficking? Why would someone want to coach at Alabama given that the governor of Alabama once stood in front of the school’s auditorium to prevent desegregation?
The answer is that these are all great institutions, and so is Ole Miss. I seriously doubt that a coach with any level of life experience would automatically dismiss Ole Miss for the reasons you suggest. I also doubt that coaching in Jo-Pa’s now-sex-scandal-plauged shadow is substantially more attractive, if more attractive at all, than the opportunity to compete against some of the best teams in the country every weekend.
Framing a potential coach’s choice as being between ‘building on a successful program’ and ‘reviving ours’ is rather shallow. Any coach worth supporting would view Ole Miss as a program that offers the opportunity to ‘build’ a successful team and a legacy, rather than a program in need of ‘reviving’. If you remove W’s and L’s from the equation, an argument can be made that Ole Miss is quite successful. We are scandal free, are in the midst of a major capital campaign, and have supporters willing to donate to that campaign, not to mention the other intangibles I discussed in my first post. All of these intangibles set us apart from many programs, and for that reason, I argue that we have more to offer than we give ourselves credit for. Moreover, I think that a savvy coach will quickly recognize these attributes.
To answer your question, I don’t know. My point is that we should, and could, keep the bar high. As to Sumlin, he is probably one of the better candidates to be considered. I would not “look down” on his hiring, but before we hire anyone, we should explore all options, even ones that may seem unattainable. Not doing so would be like asking the second-prettiest girl to the school dance because you were too scared to ask the first-prettiest girl (and this situation only gets more frustrating when the first-prettiest girl tells you months later that she wished you had invited her to the dance because she liked you, but she has a new boyfriend now and considers you to be in the friend zone).
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
by goulajamz on Nov 9, 2011 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Memphis part was a bit of a joke
and a reference to the fact that a lot of coaches from outside the deep South aren’t especially keen on moving to rural Mississippi. However, in no way was I saying we shouldn’t keep the bar high. I’m just saying that reality has to factor into our decision making process. As of right now, Ole Miss is NOT a destination job. Now, if a good coach comes in, he could change that perception quickly by winning consistently. But perception in College Football is often reality. The perception of Ole Miss, from outside the deep south is that we’re wedged between two behemoths of college football, have the 11th ranked athletic budget in the SEC, have the smallest student body, a tinged racial history, chaos in the AD’s office, and a contingent of fans who are freaking the fuck out over Confederate symbols. Now, you and I both know that there is much more to Ole Miss than what everyone else sees. But potential big name coaching candidates didn’t go to Ole Miss and don’t see it through the same lens we do.
I’m not saying that Archie shouldn’t give Chris Petersen or Gary Patterson or even Nick Saban a call. I’m just saying let’s not pretend that Ole Miss is currently as attractive as the Penn State or Ohio State job.
Again, I agree that we should shoot for the absolute best coach who will have us. But if we don’t realize that not everyone has the magical, enchanting image of Oxford that we do, we’ll end up swinging, missing and having to hire some insane cajun defensive line coach. Our facilities are good, Oxford is a great town, but a lot of coaches don’t want to live in rural Mississippi. That’s fine, fuck ‘em. I would love to see us go get an unbelieveable head coach, but until Chip Kelly or Brett Billema or Jim Harbaugh starts talking about how interested they are in the Ole Miss job, I’ll keep my reservations.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
Perspectives
It appears that our only disagreement is whether the cup is half-full or half-empty. Either way, the cup needs more bourbon.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
I'm a pessimistic guy
it helps me cope.
And indeed, no cup is really ever full unless there is bourbon in it.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
Voted Team Leach.
Would love to cast another ballot for Rocker as DC.
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
coach
With Leach comes with baggage, if nothing else, his quirky personality. Smart, if he took the job, would have a hard time turning Georgia down should they come calling. Smulin or RichRod, with a strong D coordinator.
Deserve's got nothin' to do with it. Will Munny, The Unforgiven
Does anyone actually give a shit about a coach's personality as long as they are WINNING?
Can we please quit with all this “we’ve already hired a goofy, quirky coach”. That wasn’t the reason we fired him.
Actually, some people do.
There’s this crazy notion that the head coach is supposed to represent the university, and it sullies the victory if you don’t do it in the right way. I will say that some people genuinely don’t care: if you win, nothing else matters. There are plenty of examples of that.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
Nick Saban is a vile sonofabitch
but people aren’t too hung up on that because he wins.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 5:52 AM EST up reply actions
Stepping Stone
I for one don’t give a dang if a coach uses Ole Miss as a stepping stone for a bigger job.
Just freaking win and leave the program in decent enough condition that the next hire can pick up and carry on!!!!
See Michigan State (Saban), LSU, Boise State(Hawkins), Ok State (Miles).
by ProphetMB on Nov 8, 2011 4:38 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Watch whatca say
Tubs used us as one and we still haven’t recovered
Cutcliffe...
Didn’t pick up and carry on. He just lived off what Tubs left. Cutcliffe didn’t recruit worth a dang other than the 1 name that got him hired. Good guy. Too conservative to survive at Ole Miss.
Second Chance Coaches!
I am hoping for a coach that has name recognition, one that can tell a recruit that he knows about the NFL and how to get him there, who has real awards for coaching, proven that he can manage a program to the BCS, can work for cheap and who is looking to remain with a program for a while (second chance coaches). I know this makes hot assistant fans like Malzhan and Smart supporters upset, but this program is ill prepared for a two to three year coach using Ole Miss as a stepping stone. Additionally, coordinators jumping to coaches are higher unproven risks. Second Chance coaches are looking to prove their critics wrong and know the NCAA is psychopathic. What doesn’t kill them makes them stronger and hopefully, smarter. A few partially fit this type of coach; Leach does not. Good fit for Ole Miss- Jim Tressel; Butch Davis.
Tressel, Davis?
I hope our compliance department is aces or we’ll be on probabation again like UNC and Ohio State
Jim Tressel
got any five star kid he wanted at Ohio State. I’ll attribute that to the fact that it’s Ohio State because I frankly don’t know how good of a recruiter he would be at a smaller BCS program. Also, I don’t think Tressel would take the job. In addition, I don’t know that he can take the talent we have right now and win because of his conservative coaching style. I would rather hire an unproven assistant than Butch Davis. I just don’t think either one is the best choice to lead our program after what happened at Ohio State and North Carolina.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
Tressel
Do you agree with the philosophy? If so, who fits this mold without baggage? Cheap, proven, recruiter, manager in the big games/ NFL and available. Always good to read your posts.
Thanks.
I’m a supporter of the Leach camp right now. I just think he’s the best available to us, and I think he gives us the best bang for our buck given his current circumstances. I actually think the “baggage/he’s crazy argument” with Leach does not carry that much weight because I think he’s the closest thing to homerun hire that we could make. Also, I don’t think he would care that he wouldn’t know who his new boss would be. A lot of coaches would be turned off by the fact that Boone will still be there when they’re hired, but he won’t be there in a year. Reading your specifications above, I would say that Rich Rod is a better option to fit that mold than either Tressel or Davis. I don’t have a problem with Rich Rod. I just happen to think Leach is a better coach.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 9, 2011 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
Tressel got any five star he wanted at Ohio State
because Ohio State is the only big time program in Ohio, a fairly talent-rich region when it comes to high school football. He basically had all of Ohio and western Pennsylvania to himself.
Agreed
the state of Ohio is a blue chip factory, and Tressel had first picks on all of them. That had less to do with Tressel as a coach and more to do with Ohio’s love for OSU.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 8:50 PM EST up reply actions
Tressel was at Youngtown State
Tressel didn’t have his choice at Youngstown State where he went 135–57–2. The man can recruit on any level.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 9:33 PM EST up reply actions
It's talent rich because
it’s the fifth largest state in America. The other states which are larger have a gazillion BCS level schools (Texas, Florida, California), except for New York, of course, which doesn’t really care for college football.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 5:54 AM EST up reply actions
I want..
Venerable as head coach, so we would run a spread offense and be able to recruit in Texas and maybe finally get a good hs Qb.
After listening to a sports show this am and doing some research, I’m on the Freeze bandwagon. They, Asu, mind you were competitive On the road at Illinois and va tech. His offense and defense are top 50 and top 60 I believe in rankings and Asu may not lose another game. Yes I would like to see more but, he has been very successful at everyplace, and was exposed to Orgeron recruiting nationally. I was hesitant until I did the research. He could be the next Malzahn, he knows Ole Miss, and the whole blind side thing doesn’t hurt either.
On a side note check out Louisville’s AD.
by hotstove97 on Nov 8, 2011 5:38 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Here's why we should take a shot at Leach.
1) He’s a big time name and an exciting guy. He will put asses in the seats no matter whether people like him or hate him. He will increase donations to the capital fund drive because people will KNOW that we’re serious about winning and will do just about anything to win, including hiring someone completely out of the normal mold of an SEC HC. Sure, there might be a few hardcore, Southern gentile types who will bitch, moan and/or with hold big money because of his controversial past, but no hire is going to be perfect for everyone and even if a few donors with hold, it will still be a net gain once the silent cap n’ t-shirt crowd open their wallets.
2) We don’t have a big name AD yet. Worst case scenario is that Leach is hired the day after our last game this year. Our new AD is hired some where around the end of spring or hell, even after 2012 football starts. He’s told before he’s hired that he has absolute authority to evaluate Leach and the entire staff from day one to determine their suitability. Meanwhile, Leach and Co. spend 2012 getting pieces picked up and recruiting hard with decent success, they show enough flashes of brilliance to keep butts in the seats and money flowing in. Leach just can’t put it together for ‘13 or ’14 and it becomes clear to our bad ass AD that he’s not the guy. Our AD has been quietly searching for a replacement since the end of ‘12 because he knew there was a decent chance that Leach wasn’t going to fit or have a break down and strangle a player. Sometime between the end of ’13 and ’14, Leach is let go and deemed an “experiment by the previous administration” and the new HC (an ass kicking, demon of a HC) comes in to take over with a decently stocked pantry and an AD who cares about one thing, and one thing only.
3) If Leach works out. If he get’s his hands on a great DC, is able to recruit just enough great talent to operate his system and can out smart Bama, LSU, Aub and Arky defenses a couple times a year, we are GOING to play in Atl and we are GOING to get a BCS bowl, and you know this. He’s a crazy, smart, disciplined, head strong asshole who will not take any shit from players, coaches, admins, Alumns or fans. He wants to win. He wants to coach for a school that is obsessed with winning. And if he’s successful, I believe that he’ll be able to teach our pathetic, party and fashion consumed fans, Alumni and students how to really, REALLY fucking care about winning.
4) We structure his contract in an intelligent and incentive based way so that if he is successful and stays, he makes a ton but if he’s turrible and gets booted, we don’t get fucked in the ass with a broken telephone pole. This way, we’re still in good shape to throw big money at our next AD’s top choices in 2-4 years.
by OxpatchReb on Nov 8, 2011 5:41 PM EST reply actions 7 recs
Mike Leach is, in my opinion,
head and shoulders above everybody else available to us. He’s an intelligent, competent coach, and he would know that a top, solid defensive coordinator is necessary to compete in the SEC. On that note, it looks like Nutt threw Leach some props today in his interview on Tim Brando’s radio show. Nutt said he thinks someone who can do something different on offense is needed in Oxford. He then mentioned Mike Leach. If nothing else, it’s interesting to note. I’ll also put it in a fanshot but here’s the link.
http://www.mrsec.com/2011/11/nutt-suggests-leach-would-fit-at-ole-miss/
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
LEACH'S DC DOES NOT MATTER, CAUSE YOU CAN'T HAVE A GREAT DEFENSE WITH A SPREAD OFFENSE
Guys,
You can’t have a great defense and/or great DC with a spread offense, bc you just don’t hit in practice. You have no TE’s or FB’s, so in two a days and in spring you are running your base 4-2-5 or your a 4-1-6. Why do you think Rich Rod couldn’t stop anyone in Michigan? Why do you think the Big 12 cant stop anyone? Why do you think Auburn can’t stop anyone? Because they don’t hit in practice. Please name me one spread offense that had a great defense. LSU and Alabama run boring offenses because during spring they are lining up and blasting each other. See why Stanford (yes freaking Stanford, mauls people). So if you hire Leach that is fine, but don’t think he will ever get a good defense.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
All we need is a defense that's competent enough
to allow our offense to win the game for us. We don’t need a great defense or even necessarily a good defense for Leach’s system to work in Oxford. If the defense is fundamentally sound because Leach has a solid D-coordinator, then that will be enough for the level we are trying to get the program to right now. Let me remind you, Auburn won a national championship with a defense that was mediocre at best (yes they had Nick Fairley but their secondary was awful; they still held Oregon to 19 points). Also, Florida had a pretty damn good defense in 2008 and 2009 so I don’t think your theory is accurate.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 6:21 PM EST up reply actions
FLA with TEBOW was a true Spread? Serioulsy?
Did you honestly just say that Fl with Tim TEBOW was the same as a true spread offense? TEBOW is a Fullback that just took snaps. And leach never runs that type of spread. YES FLorida had a very good defense that year, because they had a 250 quarterback that ran 25 times a game and could only throw go routes. Find me a BYU (Hal Mumme got his offense from there) Air Raid (Leach got it from Mumme) or Run and shoot offense that has a good defense? Oklahoma under the Stoops is the closet thing and then he chunked it for a Fullback and TE. If you are going to hire Leach, fine, but stop talking defense. It will be basketball on grass, entertaining, and you will avg 7.5 wins. Not bad. But I could be DC under Leach. Keep them under 40 and you win.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 6:31 PM EST up reply actions
Non SEC D
I don’t think any of us that really want Leach expect to have a normal SEC deffense.
But I think that is another point in his favor. As long as he can come in and within 2 years beat all the teams we SHOULD be beating and actually making the rest of the SEC work when they play us I’d be happy.
But it would be a different style of play, the games would have more points (there would never be a 6-9 game steeled in ot). I think it would help bring Ols Miss recruits and put some butts in some seats.
Does that mean we will be playing for the SEC title in 4 years, no. But it builds us up, it improves our program, and after a while our recruits would get better, we’d start winning more games. And then after about 6 years we could be in a position to be SEC champs.
And even if that dosen’t happen and all Leach is able to do is give us is 6-7 wins a season. and a bowl game every other year. It would still be light years better than the crap we are dealing with right now.
I'm relatively certain
that a Mike Shula coached Alabama team beat Texas Tech 10-7 in a bowl game. I’m too lazy to look it up though. I just remember Demeco Ryans being beastly.
Red Cup Rebellion - An Ole Miss Blog
Turns out that we're not very good at football.
by Juco All-American on Nov 9, 2011 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
The only reason a good D-coordinator is mentioned when Leach comes up
is because Leach would need a guy that could take care of everything on that side of the ball. We’re saying the exact same thing about Sumlin or Malzahn. With those systems, the defense only has to be competent/adequate enough to let our offense win the game. And you didn’t say I had to mention a “true spread offense,” you said “You can’t have a great defense and/or great DC with a spread offense.” Florida ran a version of the spread. Tim Tebow is not solely responsible for the fact Florida had a very good defense that in 2008. That gets attributed to Brandon Spikes and Joe Haden, among many others.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
Really?
I am sorry. I thought since we were talking about Mike Leach it was assumed that we were talking about a true spread. Let me articulate my position better, if you have an offense that throws the ball 46 times and runs four sprint draws, then you shouldn’t even care about who is DC, because that is not what you hired. You hired big offense, no defense. Even if you did hire a great defensive mind, by the lack of a TE or FB and lack of hitting, you couldn’t have a great defense. Yes, competent is fine. Yes, Leach will give everything defensive to his DC, but understand that when you hire him. Don’t think we can just get a great DC. You will never have one. With that said, I don’t think Leach would be a bad hire, but discussing who his DC will be is like buying Hummer and then talking about how you are going to save gas.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
I understand your point,
but when we discuss potential head coaches people are going to throw out opinions on what they think the staff around the potential head coach should/could look like. It doesn’t matter which candidate is being discussed. If someone mentions Smart, someone will inevitably bring up what our offense might look like based on their opinions. It’s all a part of the flurry of ideas that fans throw out there when their school is hiring a new coach. Whether we’re right or wrong is your opinion, and you may very well be right. However, we’re not going to just mention an Offensive mastermind and not talk about the other side of the ball.
We’re fans. This means that we speculate on a bunch of things that we think are possible (no matter how unrealistic) because we’re all borderline obsessed with athletics at Ole Miss as sad as that is sometimes.
I always say 'beer me.' It gets a laugh, like, a quarter of the time.
by BeerMeAHottyToddy on Nov 8, 2011 7:42 PM EST up reply actions
If you can tell me the last team
that consistently went 1’s v. 1’s, where both the offense and defense used their actual offense in practice, I’ll give you 1,000 Red Cup Points. Neither offenses or defenses go against their counterparts on the same team. The second-team defense will emulate whatever their next opponent does and vice versa. LSU was able to defend (relatively) well against Oregon and Alabama, two completely different defenses.By your stance, how could they have pulled that off if their offense was just a vanilla-run game?
The fact that you think defenses practice against their own offense and scheme to play against their own offense is ridiculous. Do you honestly think a defensive coordinator at a school that runs a spread offense would say “Well, I guess since our offense runs a spread, I will run a base 3-3 because obviously I’d rather be prepared to defend against our offense than the ones we’ll face the rest of the season.”
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
Weak point is weak.
And Oklahoma throws for over 4,000 yards each year. They’re not exactly a smash-mouth offense. You and I both know that the correlation between offensive system and defense is bunk.
Rich Rod’s WVU squads had very good defense. Now, try to rationalize your point again.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 9:47 PM EST up reply actions
Stop asking for reasonable thoughts and rational arguments.
You will not find them here. They want Leach because Leach loves pirates.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
I like Leach
because I think a pass-happy offense would benefit us more than a traditional system. I think he gives us the best chance to immediately win 6, 7 or 8 games. I think he is the most likely to consistently beat the lower tier schools and regular compete with the middle tier of the SEC. I think that’s a starting point that would be the right move for now.
I would prefer that over taking a risk on an unproven coordinator who may or may not pan out as the head of a collegiate football program.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:12 PM EST up reply actions
Fair enough.
I don’t think Leach will make Ole Miss relevant again, but that’s not necessarily what most fans want here. They want essentially what he did at Texas Tech: at least 7-wins every year, occasional bowl wins, but no losing seasons. That last one is the biggest.
Analyzing him as a coach, I think he’s mediocre at best. But that’s just my opinion.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 10:41 PM EST up reply actions
Kind of what I'm seeing with all the people wanting Leach too.
Leach will pull Ole Miss from suckhood to mediocrity, but that’s fine with most Ole Miss fans. I’ll say one thing, this new coaching search has shown me exactly how David Cutcliffe made it at Ole Miss for so long.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Right on,
My first post, I’ve been reading this site on and off for about 2 years now. But I wanted to state why we should take Leach despite his history but you beat me to most of it.
To add:
We are in a very bad spot right now. We are the worst team in the SEC, we are in the toughest area in the NCAA, and we aren’t the only ones looking for a new HC.
We need a proven HC to be able to even hope for recruits. We need a coach who knows what he is doing. I do not think taking another teams assistant, defensive, offensive, whatever coach is even an option. Not a good one in any case.
Our discipline on the field has been well pathetic as of late, we need someone to come in and fix that asap! I believe Leach won’t have any issues with the discipline.
Leach basically just publically dropped his application for the job, so we know he wants it.
Leach wants to coach and has been denied since the TTU crap. I believe he will be grateful to us and use us to show the entire NCAA that he deserves his second chance.
I award you a Rec
And a slow clap.
"There's no better way to say 'I'm a badass' than the thumbs up. It's so hot right now."
I wrecked this for the Charles Barkley use of "turrible"
As for your point on Leach, “That’s not turrible.”
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 9:40 PM EST up reply actions
Herm Edwards?
How about Herm Edwards? I know he has not been mentioned, but I think he would be a great recruiter. A Pete Carroll type and I think we could get him, because he wanted the San Diego State Job. (He did go there). I hear that Archie is close to Oklahoma AD and wants Venerables. FEDEX vp wants Freeze
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 5:44 PM EST reply actions
Okay,
now I know you’re not real. Are you kidding me? Herm Edwards hasn’t coached college ball in 22 years and is a shitty coach at that. Why would he leave his current job for Oxford? Why would he come to College ball? Why u no reasonable?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
Thank you!
I’d fucking gouge my eyes out if Herm Edwards was even considered for the gig(gity).
by King Compton on Nov 8, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
I don't want Vernables or Freeze.
I want both. I think neither of them are ready for a head coaching gig, but I think the scenario of Vernables as HC/DC with Freeze as OC is a good one. Freeze is only making around $150K at Arkansas State, so we could EASILY pay him much more with a competitive coordinator’s salary.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:13 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Leach says he'd be interested.
Get on it Archie.
"Go then, there are other worlds than these"-The Gunslinger
by ARebel21 on Nov 8, 2011 6:03 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Another note on Leach,
We are at the bottom in graduation rate. While at TT, Leach had the 8th highest grad rate (79%) in the country behind Notre Dame (94 percent), Stanford (93), Boston College (92), Duke (92), Northwestern (92), Vanderbilt (91) and Wake Forest (83). there has to be something said for this…
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/30/AR2009123002278.html
I figure
if we’re at the bottom of the SEC, we’re probably not too high in the national rankings…
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:00 PM EST up reply actions
Because he recruits a ton of "probably not gonna go pro" types,
he gets to keep, develop, and play them for four years.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:14 AM EST up reply actions
On Leach
Do you think his “Rep” (deserved or not doesnt matter) will keep him from being able to attract recruits?
Personally I think if a kid is “afraid” of his rep he’s probably a wussy and one we dont want anyway.
His reputation as being a pirate?
Kids love pirates.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:14 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And bears
Pirates with pet bears…name me a kid that wouldn’t love THAT!!!!
I'm a Rebel, but I bleed the cherry and silver of the Lobos.
USC wasn't hot shit till they got Pete Carroll
They had success in the past and were in a decline. Then BOOM. Along comes West Coast Pete and turns the whole damn ship around. May have paid players.. but hell, they are now prominent on the national scene and that’s all we can really ask for right?
The last Rankin Rebel
I wouldn't say that.
USC has been good for decades. They didn’t really hit their resurgence until Pete Carroll.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 6:45 PM EST up reply actions
That's what I meant.
More or less.
The last Rankin Rebel
by Reb on the Rez on Nov 8, 2011 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah it's kinda like saying "Alabama sucked until they hired Saban."
They were in a decade-long slump, for sure, but they were a good program waiting for the right hire. The same can be said for USC before Carroll or Ohio State before Tressell.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:15 AM EST up reply actions
I’m really intrigued with Manny Diaz. He has a fire that makes players want to run through a wall for him from what I’ve seen. Don’t know if he’d be the least bit interested, though. If he is it would make sense… he already knows the majority of the recruits in Mississippi this year and is a good recruiter from what I hear. It may also help us retain many of the freshmen class we have right now considering he already has a previous relationship with the majority of them. Kirby would also be a good one, but I fear, considering the lack of linebackers at OM right now, it would take too long to get the Saban 3-4 scheme up and running.
by p-willie'snewtubes on Nov 8, 2011 6:31 PM EST reply actions
My problem with Mike Leach is
his antics. I know I’m probably going to get hated big time for this, considering all the unconditional love for Mike Leach on here. I don’t find him amusing, or entertaining, or hilarious. He also wreaks of bad press the longer he draws out that lawsuit against Texas Tech. I mean, it’s not hard to understand why no program has touched Leach since he was fired. The man is toxic.
That said, I can understand all the pro-Leach positions. He has a moderately impressive record—although, personally, I think it was less that he was a “freakin’ genius” and more because he had full cupboards when he arrived and kept momentum going.
I mean, what are all the Leach fanatics going to say when he eventually has a losing season? Ole Miss turns on their coaches pretty fast.
I think a lot of Leach’s success at Texas Tech came because no one really knew who he was and he wasn’t under a great deal of scrutiny—that is, until the James case hit. I doubt he’ll ever find a quiet enough job like Texas Tech where can work his “magic” and nobody’s really watching him. I think he really blew his chance.
Leach came into a full cupboard at TT!?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:01 PM EST up reply actions
Okay, maybe not "full" in the traditional sense...
but Spike Dykes already had the momentum going. Leach just continued it. Dykes’ last four years at TTU were virtually identical to all of Leach’s. The only difference was that Leach brought in an innovative offense, and five helpings of crazy.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Nonsense sir! Nonsense!
Dykes had two 9 win seasons and averaged less than 7 wins a year. Once TT went to the Big 12, Dykes never won more than 7 games. TT didn’t even go to a bowl Dykes’ last season and Leach came in and continually improved that team (averaging 9 wins a season) despite having OK State, Texas A&M, Texas and Oklahoma in their division.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
You don't find him amusing or entertaining?
We’re not entering him in a talent show, we want to win football games! Let’s keep our focus where it should be, folks.
Meager just has a personal dislike for Leach,
that is all.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
That's pretty much it.
But I still welcome opposing arguments. Y’all are free to worship Leach all you want, just count me out of the ceremony.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
Leach has 232 votes
out of over 600. I think to qualify as “worship”, it would take at least 50% support.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
Not everybody is like this
But it sure does seem like a lot of people would kiss Leach’s feet if he became the Ole Miss coach.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
I've said it before, I'll say it again
I’m on the Kevin Sumlin train. I just don’t think Leach would be a terrible hire. I’d be alright with either one, but Sumlin is my favorite for sure. I’d love if Sumlin would bring Tracy Rocker as the DC. Between both of their recruiting prowess and coaching abilities, I think that’d be a good move. I just really like Rocker because of how D-line-centric this league is, and he’s one of the best D-line coaches I know of. He recruits and develops players into NFL caliber lineman.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 9:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think Leach would be a terrible hire either.
Ole Miss could do much, much worse, and I’m definitely afraid they will. But I’m not seeing why he’s the #1 guy.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Let's not forget...
that there are idiots, casual football fans and non-Ole Miss followers of this blog. I think a lot of the other fans would find it entertaining for us to have Leach. And for the casual fan, Leach is probably the name a lot of people actually know. If I gave my wife that list, she would only recognize Leach and RichRod. Coming from a Big East school, she would not pick RR.
I'm a Rebel, but I bleed the cherry and silver of the Lobos.
Here's why I want Leach as simply and plainly as it can possibly be explained.
I. Want. To. Win. Period.
I’m not kissing anyone’s feet, ass, hands or belt line, brah. I want to win more than any human being on the whole damn planet. Leach is a plug and play type hire. Anyone else we get will take at LEAST 2 years to get things rolling (possibly double that if we hire a coordinator) and Leach is hungry to prove the country wrong right damn now. He’s a rogue, a loner and has a chip on his shoulder. He’s an ass, a disciplinarian and a exciting guy. Yes, he’s a gamble, but right NOW is the time to take that gamble. And he’s a gamble with a HUGE upside.
What exactly is it you want to win though?
Seven games a year or a championship? I’ve heard so many fans say they want Leach because he’ll never get embarrassed by Vanderbilt or Kentucky and he’ll win 7 games a year. Heck some people have said that on this very blog. Is that really our standard? That should be a short-term goal for sure, but I’m really worried people are happy just settling for being a mediocre-to-decent team.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Basically, yes
If anyone thinks any coach is going to come in and get us a championship within 2 years is probably crazy. I son’t care if we grabbed Saban…
Right now our goal should be a coach who can come in and get us to winning about 7 games a year and sell more tickets. We start winning more we can get better recruits. Need to get consistanly good before we can expect to got for championships.
Would Leach get us to a championship? Hell if I know, but he could build the program up. Me personally I’d rather be winning 7 games a season for a decade than to have 1-2 great years and the rest look like we do right now.
And to add to what OxpatchReb just said: Yes Leach is a gamble, but it is a perfect time to take that gamble:
1. Leach is avaliable and wants the job. He still has a chip on his shoulder with the NCAA and has something to prove.
2. We are currently the worst we have ever been, we are about to break our worst season record. If we try getting a coach from another school I have to ask, why would he come here? There are alot of other schools in a better position right now that will be hiring at the end of this season.
3. Worst case Leach dosen’t work out and we would be doing the same damn thing we would probably be doing anyway with most of the other coaches, paying him off and looking for a new one. Except we can probably get Leach to sign a contract that will work out better for UM than we could most other coaches.
The team has to be good before great
and before you start thinking BCS. We can’t plan on having the right pieces (and luck) to run the table in any certain period of time. We need to consistently play 13 games and consistently compete with the other teams in our division before we can even think about a BCS bowl.
Some think we have a reputation to maintain. This is the worst team in the league. I think we have a reputation to reestablish, if not recreate.
Long-time reader, first-time typer... Imma quit typin and read.
by Old HWY 6 on Nov 9, 2011 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm wishy-washy on Leach as well
but I don’t think he’d be an awful hire by any means. I think he could come in and stabilize the team for a few years to bridge the potential meltdown of Ole Miss athletics.
Red Cup Rebellion - An Ole Miss Blog
Turns out that we're not very good at football.
by Juco All-American on Nov 9, 2011 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
So long as we dont freaking have to mortgage the Lyceum to get him there and the contract outs are ALLLLLLL on our side.
How many people have forgotten he’s a mother grabbin lawyer and I believe still in a bunch of lawsuits with his former employer???
Thats EXACTLY what we dont need. A short term fix that bites us more in the ass for years to come.
He sued Tech because they fired him for bogus reasons.
He’s not just a flippiant idiot who throws lawsuits around for fun.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
As in all disputes, it just depends on who’s eyes you are looking at it through. I agree TT was a dumbass, but TT felt like they had to do it to CYA. Who’s to say if some crap like that happened again at UM the board wouldnt react in the same CYA manor.
Just sayin if I were negotiating the contract (especially with someone that is currently a piriah basically in the NCAA….. ie WE would be negotiating from a point of strength) that I would make damn sure we held most if not all the cards with regard to buy-out clause, termination of services, etc, etc.
Whatever you may think
Leach was fired because he had a huge bonus coming. It had very little to do with Craig James’ son.
Red Cup Rebellion - An Ole Miss Blog
Turns out that we're not very good at football.
by Juco All-American on Nov 9, 2011 12:35 PM EST up reply actions
I have a hard time believing Texas Tech fired him over not wanting to pay a bonus.
That’s just complete freaking stupidity if they did that and everybody in charge of their athletics department should have been fired on the spot.
I’ve heard this one before, but I’ve never seen any actual proof of it.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
it was the administration
The beef was with the University President, not the athletic department, from what I understand
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
Leach's problem with TTU
was that he was becoming more loved by the people of TTU and Lubbock than the AD and administration wanted him to be.
When Leach’s last contract was being negotiated he wanted to be paid among the top 5 coaches in the then Big 12. The AD had agreed to it then the administration vetoed it wanting Leach to take a pay cut. They thought Leach had grown bigger than the university. Leach went into his last year of his contract saying that the administration will either give him a new contract similar to what he had already agreed to or that he would go somewhere else. The university finally approved the contract that had previously been agreed to.
Before the ink was dry on that contract, the administration was on record for looking for a way to oust Leach before the new contract was in effect. Enter Craig “I’ve ruined two Texas Universities” James. He never liked Leach. He had a soapbox and an axe to grind, the administration saw a way to not look like the bad guys. You then get the Leach situation.
If you look at court documents you will see that Young James himself went into the closet and thought it was funny. He said that he thought his dad shared his same sense of humor and decided to send the video to his dad.
Leach is being made to look like the bad guy. He isn’t perfect, but he is a lot better than most.
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
Yeah
Every independent account has basically said the James were a bunch of fuckwads. I loved when Leach went on ESPN and called them out for defending C James instead of their journalistic integrity.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The ESPN Obudsman
even called out ESPN and their lack of objectivity on the Leach subject
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
I think we will all be pretty surprised with the choice
especially with Archie talking to NFL people. I’ve read it in a post somewhere before, but I think when the announcement is made, we’ll scratch our collective heads, wonder where THAT one came from and then agree that it makes perfect sense. I do think that the coach may come from the NFL ranks….Herm Edwards seems logical. He wants to coach again, LOVES the SEC, and always seemed to me cut out more for the college than pro game. But…and this is wild speculation/wishful thinking….what about Tony Dungy?
Think about it….Peyton’ connection; Super Bowl ring; he has expressed a desire to coach in college if he returns and has said he would consider coaching again. Just a thought.
Once more thought…any chance Nix keeps his job? Let’s say an offensive mind is hired, even Leach, and he likes what he sees in Nix personally. Will he have one year to impress the new HC?
Scary
This is what I’m worried about the most.
A NFL coach is used to working with the best, and very well trained and conditioned players. We do not have that. If we get a NFL coach I’m worried he won’t know how to handle our players.
A NFL coach would be great for recruiting, but would they be able to bring in enough talent that they could “smooth out the rough edges”.
Totally disagree
I think a NFL coach will bring a NFL work schedule. I think what has really happened to NUTT and Spurrier is that they like being the coach. They like to play golf and go talk to boosters. Nick Saban and Bobby Petrino are simply working an NFL schedule and I don’t think they care about talking to humans much less boosters. Now, I see the NFL problem as not being able to recruit the players, because they never had to do that before. However, I just think coaching is better at the NFL than colleges. If Charlies Weiss could recruit defensive players, he would be at Notre Dame today.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Except Petrino and Saban sucked in the NFL
Weiss was actually a good OC with New England. If Charlie Weiss could recruit defensive players, he’d still be a college head coach. His ability (or lack thereof) to recruit defensive players is a huge reflection on his abilities as a college coach. Saban is a great recruiter and an efficient coach with a winning system. He puts in the man hours. He wasn’t a good NFL coach though. They’re two different games.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:04 PM EST up reply actions
Herm Edwards?
Am I the only person who ever saw him coach a game?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:02 PM EST up reply actions
huh??
If you state the NFL and college are two different games, which they are, then you can’t say that how herm Edwards did in the NFL is a proper indicator of how he will do in college. Saban, Petrino, Spurrier all sucked at the NFL. And your point is? You need a major personality that can recruit. Edwards, like Pete Carrol, has that quality. Nutt can coach. Just couldn’t recruit.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 10:12 PM EST up reply actions
Herm Edwards has literally not recruited anyone
since the Berlin Wall fell.
And the point that Nutt can’t recruit is absurd. Did I miss something about this year’s recruiting class? Or maybe only shitty recruiters consistently pick up top-30 classes, despite being the second-smallest school in the SEC. Now, if you want to say Nutt has problems with attrition, I wholly agree. Hell, I wrote an article on it. But to say that Nutt was not good at signing talented players is untrue.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
Really?
http://www.clarionledger.com/article/20111108/COL0504/111080338/Recruiting-failures-led-Ole-Miss-coach-Nutt-s-downfall?odyssey=mod|newswell|text|Home|s
Dude, are you serious? Well here is Rick Cleveland’s article saying he can’t recruit? So he was a great recruiter that just didnt get any talent for the last three years even After his precious two cotton bowls? He couldn’t land a player? and I am a great nfl qb that just never played in the NFL. Yes, attrition of your recruits is part of the recruiting job!!! see Terry Bowden. As for this year’s class, Really? You are going to tell me this is a great class after one year? really? Because of who, Nutt saying they will go to Atlanta? Brasswell was coming to Ole Miss b/c of the South Panola pipeline not Nutt. After four years it is obvious, that Nutt coached the hell out of Oregeron’s players, but could not recruit on his own. If you have any questions, see his years at Arkansas. He actually said at his press conference, he didn’t know recruiting was this hard at Miss. with three schools.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
Rick Cleveland is a fucking idiot.
Cleveland also thinks Southern could win 8-9 games in the SEC on the reg.
He just says over and over that Nutt didn’t do a good job recruiting. There are no examples demonstrating his supposed failings. If you wanna talk about his ability to maintain discipline, I’m all ears. But I literally wrote a long-ass piece this summer about the attrition of players after a year or two. Clarence Jackson (had offers from UGA, Tenn, etc) stole a TV from the school. Delvin Jones (spurned Miami, UF and other schools for us) lit a goddamn couch on fire in the dorms and Raymond Cotton pussied out. Attrition is part of maintaining program discipline. Recruiting involves getting players to commit to your team. Developing them as players and humans is a different matter altogether.
I mean, Goddamn, do you even read what you’re writing? You’re arguing A) That Nutt was a better coach than he was a recruiter (I don’t know how the fuck you came to that conclusion) and B) That Herm Edwards could recruit better than Nutt (based on a sample size of zero).
Also, trying to dismiss this year’s class as if that wasn’t Nutt’s responsibility is horseshit. Brassell was leaning towards State and Bama and Nutt convinced him to come to Ole Miss. Nutt kept that pipeline open that will remain in place with Isaac Gross, Temario Strong and hopefully Antonio Connor. Hell, was Nutt a shit recruiter when he got Donte Moncrief to come to Ole Miss instead of WVU, OK State, UCLA, and all the SEC schools? Your argument is not only stupid as shit, but not grounded in facts.
Of course recruiting is hard in Mississippi with three division one schools. Yet somehow, Nutt finished in the top quarter in the nation all four seasons.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
Discipline
You could add Melvin Harris, Nathan Stanley, and Jesse Grandy to the attrition list.
Someone told me several months ago that a lot of the discipline issues the Rebs have been facing are due various policies in the athletic department. I can’t remember exactly how he explained it, but one example he gave had something to do with player allowances. He also said that the school wouldn’t pay for the coaches to eat with the players. I guess I can see how that would limit the coaches’ abilities to stay involved the players’ personal lives.
I’m not sure how our athletic department’s internal policies/rules regarding football compare to those at other schools, but the person who explained all of this was pretty certain that we are doing things differently, and not in a good way. If anyone here is privy to the inner-workings between the athletic department and the football team, I’d love to know if there is any truth to all of this.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
Beat me to it.
Rick Cleveland’s a hayseed.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:27 AM EST up reply actions
NUTT SUCKED AS A RECRUITER!!! How many sources do you want?
Uh Oh, you cursed me. I am scared. First let me retort. I base my premise that Nutt is a better coach than recruiter, because he want to two cotton bowls with O’s players. Second, his players are now on the worst sec losing streak ever. Now, we can argue whether attrition and recruiting are different, but in reality, recruiting is not how many stars you get or who wins the rankings, but who keeps the program full of what??? football players. He didn’t do it. Now, as for Brassell, Nutt really didn’t have anything to do with that. If you are as good as a reporter as you are, you know who did, but let me say this….No NCAA rules were violated in his recruiting. I will give him Moncrief, but Ole Miss has always had been able to find good skill players. It is those big uglies up front that we need to get. You realize Brassell is playing both ways because Nutt has not recruited any talent? What is this JV? However, you wanted facts. Please see 8 articles that say NUTT couldn’t RECRUIT. Now, I bet you can’t find 8 sources that says he was a great recruiter. Hell you can’t find 8 people on this blog. So either you provide your facts besides your opinion, or you pull yourself a tall glass of shut the fuck up.
Yahoo says “But those victories came with recruits brought to Ole Miss by former coach Ed Orgeron, who was widely seen as a terrific recruiter but terrible game-day coach. Once the roster started filling with Nutt’s recruits, the talent level dropped noticeably.”
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-mississippi-nutt
“The main thing you always hear is that Coach Nutt was not a great recruiter.”
http://www.oxfordmississippi.com/houston-nutt-let-go-as-coach-of-ole-miss-rebels-a-character-report/
Houston Nutt’s weaknesses really boil down to two things:
1. Houston Nutt is not a great recruiter which EVERY good or great football coach in college football MUST be to thrive and survive.
http://coacheshotseat.com/coacheshotseatblog/archives/9201
But on a broader level, his losses and misssteps on the recruiting trail meant that once Oregeron’s players graduated, he was starting down the barrel of a sizable talent disadvantage against nearly every SEC team he faced in 2010 and ’11.
http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/33173510
Then he and his staff (many of which have been with him through all this) either get lazy recruiting or misjudge way too many players and end up with very few SEC caliber athletes. Gambles on a one-and-done QB that another school dismissed. Fail. Took a handful of risky academic or citizenship kids that didn’t pan out. Fail.
Recruiting misses and attrition caught up with him the past two years,
http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/32564/its-time-for-change-at-ole-miss
The latter may have been the real cause behind Nutt’s demise, as it seemed the majority of the gambles Nutt took during recruiting failed
http://cfn.scout.com/2/1126164.html
But all of this happened for a reason – several poor recruiting classes in a row caught up with Nutt, who has had to rely on an abundance of freshmen and sophomores.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
You just don't get it
do you?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Google "Nutt Great Recruiter" and it replies Didd you mean "shitty recruiter"
I get that you can’t find any independent sources to verify your opinion or in your words “Your argument is not only stupid as shit, but not grounded in facts.” Or you are the smartest person in the world and everyone else are idiots. Soooooooo either find me some articles, present day would be nice, saying that Nutt is a great recruiter ( and not those rankings that come out before a freaking kid has played a down bc they had mackey over Newton for god sake) finish that glass of shut the fuck up cause I have a second one for you right here.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
You act like
Chris Lowe and Rick Cleveland are fucking gurus on recruiting. First, your articles are what are just echoing sentiments. None of them present examples explaining Nutt is a shit recruiter.
I have never said he was a great recruiter, I said he wasn’t shitty at it but was not good at developing players, maintaining discipline etc.
Your links are just part of the internet echo chamber. One person says there were recruiting failures and they all parrot that point. There were certainly some misses, but we also snatched some good players from other schools. Alot of them didn’t pan out.
You can dismiss the rankings, but there’s a reason that schools consistently in the top 10 are some of best programs in the nation. Those services make mistakes, but more often than not, the stud players are quality footballers.
I’ll literally address each of your links:
1) David Brandt’s piece just says “the talent level dropped noticeably”. Attrition. There’s only 15 of the class of 37 still on the team. Most of those got in trouble when they weren’t playing their freshman season. I agree that the talent dropped noticeably. However, the next paragraph, Brandt points to this class of freshman, but why include that in your talking point?
2) Your second link from the Oxford is absurd. The only quote that pertains to this discussion is the writer opining "The main thing you always hear is that Coach Nutt was not a great recruiter. "
Again, I agree, Nutt wasn’t a great recruiter. But he wasn’t shit either.
3) Your third link just says that Nutt isn’t a great recruiter. Again, an opinion with no actual analysis (much like yours). Seriously, have you ever written a research paper? Do you know what it means to invoke facts in your argument instead of just quoting other people’s opinions that agree with yours?
4) You conveniently leave out “(It didn’t help that several of his highest-profile signees, like now-exiled receiver Patrick Patterson, wound up being total busts.)” If you saw Pat Patterson play in high school, there was no reason to think he wouldn’t be a difference maker. The same can be said of Tig Barksdale and all those other guys from that class. Again, attrition and discipline. He got talented players to campus. For a number of reasons, they didn’t work out.
5) A fucking Arkansas player/alumni’s opinion of Nutt? Get the fuck outta here with that.
6) Again, Edward Aschoff just says “Recruiting misses and attrition”…with no point. He quickly follows that up saying that the quarterback situation was the biggest issue. Nutt recruited a good QB, Raymond Cotton, who got his feelings hurt when Nutt sent Stanley to the Manning camp. Attrition.
7) Again, just another echo-chamber opinion.
Now, each of your links has been addressed. Moreover, your dismissal of recruiting rankings is just goddamn weak. The teams that consistently recruit in the top 10 field good teams year after year. There are some misses by those sites for sure, but to act like those rankings don’t matter is weak as fuck.
Finally, “Glass of shut the fuck up?” Come on man, we can put together some better snark than that.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Recruiting and attrition are two sides of the same coin.
A big part of Nutt’s attrition problem was due to who he targeted and recruited. No one would argue that Tig Barksdale wasn’t a great high school baller, and I’m sure all of us were thrilled when he signed with Ole Miss. But the guy – in two tours at Ole Miss – made it to a total of 3 practices. The first day he showed up at Ole Miss he failed a drug test. Every program is going to sign some bad apples. But when you sign 37 players, only 29 ever set foot on campus as a member of the team, and only 15 remain, that tells me Nutt was signing plenty of guys (not all by any means) who had character issues, were discipline problems and/or couldn’t make their grades – no matter how many stars were beside their names.
Eschew obfuscation.
Again,
I’m not trying to say Nutt evaluates character properly, just that he was able to recruit and sign talented football players. 17-18 year old kids are wildly unpredictable. Do you think there was any way Nutt could have known Tig was going to get a DUI before he got on campus? Or that Delvin Jones was a pyromaniac? Did Clarence Jackson have a history of stealing TVs?
One of the reasons that class had so many signees was because of academic issues. He exploited a rule that has since been closed. If I were a coach of lower-tier school in the Southeast that had to worry about academic eligibility, I’d have done the same thing.
There are plenty of coaches who are able to take kids with character issues and turn them into good football players and good humans. I think Nutt is an average recruiter who is not good at player development or instilling discipline. That’s clear just from the number of pre-snap penalties we have.
Here is a piece I wrote earlier this year. In it, I argue that recruiting doesn’t mean anything if you can’t keep the players around. I make a distinction between recruiting and retention.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
However,
I wholly agree that Nutt had issues targeting at-risk players and wish we had known what we know now.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
I think we are in total agreement.
Thanks for the link to your August piece. That was excellent.
Eschew obfuscation.
Danka.
It appears that I was obfuscating my point a bit in my earlier comments.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
Thank you sutpens!!!!!
Mexter,
Just because you are the only one to distinguish between attrition and recruiting does not make it so. I don’t care how many articles you have written on it. You can’t find an article using google, except your own, that says Nutt was a great or good recruiter. Riddle me this batman, if Scout and Rivals knew that none of those players would turn out or make it to campus, would they give those classes the same grades? Of course not, because it is assumed by everyone that you get your recruits on the field. So in other words the only way to grade recruiting based on fact is to look at the players that are on the field. No opinion or speculation there. Just fact. So until you show me a sources, you do use sources in your professional right, that distinguishes between attrition and recruiting or calls NUTT a great recruiter, barkeep order my friend mexter and his sidekick ghost two bottles of Shut the fuck up.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
I don't have to respect your authority, amigo.
Tone the fuck down. You’re being an ass.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
omg
DAD!!!!!!! I was making a nice civil comment when mexter started with the" Goddam and shit" comments. Where is his tone me down? He hurt my feelings actually but that is ok? Pick on the new guy? A little hazing? Please regulate both equally or explain to me how I was an ass and he was civil when he cursed me first.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
We do haze.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
Colored me confused.
Since when did recruiting continue after the players signed on the dotted line?
Thought that was called coaching.
Eh, semantics.
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
#facepalm. Should be color not colored
Where is that damn edit button??!?!?!
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
I think the past tense
is funnier. And yeah, apparently my definition of recruiting as “To enroll or seek to enroll” is just fucking wrong because here’s a link to a Rick Cleveland article that says so.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
omg
there were 8 links thank you very much. and only one to rick cleveland. I am right and here is a link to my own opinion to prove it, is so much better. I apologize.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
OMG y'all
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
New and improverd me
Let’s start anew. Mexter, I politely disagree with your position. Could you possibly be a good chap and provide me with other respected opinions beside your own, that state that Houston Nutt is a great recruiter? If so, I will peruse them and revisit my position. Hotty Toddy.
See Ghost, I can be nice. lmao.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
Here you go this should answer your questions.
http://www.redcuprebellion.com/2011/11/8/2547005/tuesday-question-one-that-bears-repeating#
tripleB.tumblr.com // msbeernut.com
Why should I defend your straw man?
I never once said Nutt was a great recruiter. I have maintained that he was simply not shitty, as you said.
However, below you indicate that Nutt was an average recruiter. So…
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
I said he was an average recruiter coming into Ole Miss and fall in love with his success. He assumed he was going to be great at recruiting just like he assumed he would beat state. These assumptions cost him. His ego caused him to be shitty while at ole miss. Once again, We can do this all day, but it comes down to this. That is the worst football team to ever step on an SEC football field. period. Now, I will say that is due to recruiting, you will say that is due to attrition, but the college coaches I know factor in attrition in their recruiting calculations. They will tell you terry bowden, No.1 class and no one got in. Nutt is acting like attrition was brand new factor. it is not. Either you are tuberville and you recruit thug high and keep them on campus or you don’t and factor that into the recruiting, but nowhere do you say have the attrition rate nutt had, because it showed his lack of planning and strategy as did signing 39 players, no defensive and offensive philosophy
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 4:25 PM EST up reply actions
No, you didn't say that he was an average recruiter coming in to Ole Miss, you said:
NUTT SUCKED AS A RECRUITER!!!
and
Google “Nutt Great Recruiter” and it replies Didd you mean “shitty recruiter”.
And if you had been bothered to read the piece I wrote on the attrition from the class of 2009, you would have understood my point as being pretty similar to yours. But I guess getting butthurt, contradicting your own points and trying to argue with logical fallacies is cool too.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
Last time
Should have never tried to argue with someone who’s independent source is his own article and someone that infers is a wizard. Good Night mexter. God Bless. You have been a nice distraction from this article I am writing. :)
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 4:44 PM EST up reply actions
Funny you brought that wizard thing up.
Because when I saw your name, I thought of this.
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
The butthurt is strong with this one
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
factord_agin,
Your logic that coaching, and thus the responsibility of preventing attrition, begins upon signing the player is compelling. However, as Mexter points out, “Nutt had issues targeting at-risk players.” In this light, potential attrition should have been a factor considered by Nutt during the recruitment process. As evidenced by the many examples of attrition under Nutt, this factor was apparently not given adequate weight in selecting recruits, and this tarnishes his reputation as a ‘good recruiter.’
I’m sure he did not plan on all of these players leaving, but as head coach, the buck stops with him. I can’t think of any examples of players at Arkansas leaving while Nutt was coach, and when he move to Ole Miss, it is more likely that the recruiting atmosphere changed more than his coaching style. All of this suggests that sub-par recruiting, rather than sub-par coaching, is the source of attrition (i.e., He did not suddenly become an unlikeable and unruly coach when he moved to Ole Miss.).
Now, one could argue that his recruiting was not sub-par because recruiting at Ole Miss was more difficult than it was at Arkansas, and that he actually did the best with what he had. But I think this argument diminishes the level of accountability a head coach should have.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
It was NUTT"s ego
The reality of the situation is that NUTT looked at how easy he had it with O’s players and his two 9 win seasons and thought he could do that every year. If O was incompetent at coaching, he had to be an idiot at recruiting right? Also, Nutt thought he could run off these players and replace them easily. He simply could not. So, it was probably Nutt being an average recruiter, too much success too soon, not having to recruit in Arkansas, the SEC passing him by, and lack of a philosophy on either side of the ball.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
I thought Nutt was a shitty recruiter?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
Ghost ??? You see what nice got me
I tried to throw you a bone Mexter, but this is what I get for attempting to be nice. When I said shitty I was talking about only at Ole Miss, because overall he was average recruiter that got lazy….thus equal his shittiness at Ole Miss. Guys it comes down to this, I have seen Billy Brewer and Jackie Sherrill go to Miss. JuCO system and produce a better product than what we have now. Cassius Ware and Dewayne Dotson didn’t come to Ole Miss bc they had a ton of options. Gary Abide. So in my mind, for not Nutt not to use the JUCO systerm and go 5-7, yes he is a shitty recruiter.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
It is not our talent. I don't think.
We’ve lost depth but I think we’ve had the talent to be 5-7/6-6 the past two years.
tripleB.tumblr.com // msbeernut.com
they are one in the same
Thile,
You dont see that as one and the same. We have some decent ones, but we have no talent on the second string. We lose the games in the 3rd quarter because we have no talented back ups. I honestly wihout any hyperbole think the no. 1 juco team in Miss. could give Ole Miss all they could handle. Honestly, because I think while they would be younger, they would be more talented, deeper and better coached.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Regardless of what any of us think regarding Nutt's 'crootin,
we can agree that our team lacks depth and seniority. I blame it on attrition but whatever, it really doesn’t matter at this point. He’s not our coach, so arguing as to what he does and does not do well is moot.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
Marco Cristobal
will take us where we want to go!
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 5:28 PM EST up reply actions
Agree he is a great coach
He built Florida International into a winning team from scratch because before he got there FI didn’t even have a football team.
by rk9762 on Nov 9, 2011 6:38 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Wait a minute.
I got no dog in this “Is Nutt a good recruiter” fight. Just giving my opinion on what I think recruiting is vs. coaching.
But if you want my opinion, here it is:
I think Nutt took a lay of the land and decided he had to make a choice: go after the rejects nobody else wanted (except State and Ark State) and have a really nice attrition rate or go all out for the studs regardless of “character” issues. He chose the latter knowing it was up to him and his staff to keep the kids on campus (with their noses clean) if he wanted to compete against the big boys. Because he could not control his team, he lost most of his studs. Our malaise today is the direct result of Nutt’s poor coaching ability (This is a broad statement that includes all of his coaching faults, not gonna rehash them here). And I think he had about 6 million reasons to not really give a damn about how piss poor of a job he did. I personally think he lost the fire in his belly when he left Arky. Short answer: He’s a shitty coach. But not a shitty recruiter.
SB Nation needs an edit comment button so I can feel better about myself.
Kevin Sumlin gives you all Mike Leach does minus the hatred of the NCAA
Why Leach and Not Sumlin? Same offense. Leach had the Maryland job until he blasted the NCAA on his radio show.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 8, 2011 7:04 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
This point
is far too rational and level-headed.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
The three times I’ve seen UofH play this year in person the O they were running looked nothing like a Leach O. It actually seemed fairly balanced. By that I mean it wasnt designed to throw on every single down. Keenum hot reads (and plays are checked from the sideline) every time they go to the line. If you stack the box the recieers are off to the races, if you back off they run it at you. Kennum has some very good mother loving fast recievers that DO NOT drop balls EVER. Kennum has a gun and trusts his recievers to make plays and therefore isnt afraid to chuck it up downfield. Its like TT was but with 3 recievers instead of 1 stud.
But then again I’d had a few “pops” at all those games, so blindness may have set in.
Regarding the lack of dropped passes.
I’ve heard that disciples of the Hal Mumme system and those influenced by it train their receivers to catch by having them catch, with both hands, tennis balls shot out of one of those little cannons that tennis players practice with. They’ll do this for literally an hour at a time. I don’t know if it’s true or not, but it would make sense as to why receivers at Oklahoma, Texas Tech, Houston, and so forth seem to be able to automatically pluck whatever comes their way out of the air.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:34 AM EST up reply actions
All I know is they are almost all fast as hell (although not really all that big of guys) and even when the coverage is good, they go up and get the damn ball.
There was a play 2 games ago. Like a 3rd and 15 or something like that just outside the red zone. Reciever took off on a sideline route straight to the back of the endzone and was covered VERY closley. Dude didnt tip off the defender the ball was there until the VERY last second when it came over his shoulder and the defender never had a chance. Basically he was coached well and executed well.
Incomparable observations,
each and every one
As parting gifts go, the home version of Sophie’s Choice is sucksational.
Leach
I say Leach because:
A: He has already expressed interest in taking the job. Sumlin is already a HC, what would it take to get him to even consider the job?
B: Leach has baggage, but he has been shunned by other schools and is upset with the NCAA. IMO this would make him work harder to use Ole Miss to prove him self. Which would only work in our favor. His NCAA baggage cain’t hurt us much more than we are already hurting…
C: Lot of IFS: If we bring in Leach and give him a second chance and he turns our program around and we become one of the SEC big dogs (I know far fetched) there is a better chance he would stay than some coach we just pulled from some other team.
Kind of disagree
Leach wants any job he can get. He isn’t specifically attracted to Ole Miss. Word on the street is he’s actually more interested in Arizona.
Second, Leach’s baggage is a major issue. I don’t know how much the athletic department wants a loose cannon as their coach.
Again, you have to ask yourself, if Leach is so good, why hasn’t he been hired yet?
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
Word on the street?
What street? Your street?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:05 PM EST up reply actions
It's a figure of speech.
Leach has been specifically asked about the Arizona job and has expressed interest. Here’s one of the articles where his quotes are mentioned. There’s also this guy who lays out the best fit for Mike Leach. His best guess is Arizona, because its offense is identical to Texas Tech’s. And around the Arizona blogs, Leach is the primary name to replace Mike Stoops.
There. Satisfied? Or are you just feeling antagonistic?
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 10:14 PM EST up reply actions
There's been similar speculation on Ole Miss behalf,
quotes in the Commercial Appeal, a Clarion Ledger writer laying out Ole MIss as a good fit for Leach. And around this blog, Leach is also getting a lot of love. So…
I’m not being antagonistic. I’m making the point that it’s all speculation as of now.
Also, why are you here? Do you just have an axe to grind with Leach or what?
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
No, I don't.
In fact, I try to avoid talking about Leach whenever possible. But he’s so prevalent on here it’s become harder to avoid.
I don’t particularly care if he coaches again or if Ole Miss hires him. I just don’t see him as a realistic hire and get somewhat annoyed when he keeps getting mentioned. Again, there’s a reason why he hasn’t been hired yet that no one seems to see.
And you are being somewhat antagonistic. I’ve given thoughtful and respectful comments, and you ask “why are you even here?” If that’s not antagonistic, I don’t know what is. I don’t ask you why you’re here. I’m here because I’m a fan and because I’m interested in the coaching carousel. I really shouldn’t have to explain myself.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions
Let me clear the air here
1) If you try to avoid talking about Leach, but seek out a blog that is discussing him, what does that say?
2) Why do you not see him as a realistic hire? He has acknowledged his interest in Ole Miss and this entire post is a speculative question. He keeps getting mentioned because, despite what you think, he is indeed a solid football coach.
3) The fact that he hasn’t been hired by someone else doesn’t bother me. Until something comes up aside from the Adam James madness, I’ll maintain that he’s not some insane guy who is toxic for programs. Some programs have different ideas about where they want their program to go. I think he’d be an interesting fit for Ole Miss.
4) That last part was antagonistic, but I also see that you’re not really affiliated with Ole Miss and you’re just saying “I don’t like Mike Leach”. I get that. And I’m here because I went to Ole Miss, love Ole Miss athletics and occasionally write about Ole Miss athletics. I’m not demanding you to explain yourself, I’m asking you to explain why you’re so concerned with the talk of Mike Leach as a head coach on a speculative coaching thread that has also mentioned Peyton Manning and Butch Davis. Names get tossed around, people around here are giddy to get rid of Houston Nutt. Leach is fun to talk about because there’s a lot to discuss, but at least present a case for Mike Leach being a bad hire.
As an aside, I’m not necessarily on the Mike Leach train. I prefer Kevin Sumlin. However, I would not be mad about Leach and don’t think it’s absurd to discuss him here. I’m sorry that it annoys you that so many of us like him.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
Oy, do we really have to talk about me?
Very well. I will address some of your points.
1) If you try to avoid talking about Leach, but seek out a blog that is discussing him, what does that say?
I didn’t know this was a Mike Leach blog. If anything, I came here because Rich Rodriguez is also looking for a job, and you’ll notice that my initial posts were more related to him. I’ve followed Rodriguez’s career and am interested to see where he’ll end up. I thought Ole Miss would be interesting, and that he should at least be considered.
Like I said, I normally avoid all the anti-Leach stuff, because it tends to set people off (clearly), but this time it kind of got away from me.
2) Why do you not see him as a realistic hire? He has acknowledged his interest in Ole Miss and this entire post is a speculative question. He keeps getting mentioned because, despite what you think, he is indeed a solid football coach.
I never said he was an unsuccessful coach. I don’t really argue his record, other than that he hasn’t won a conference championship. The main reason I don’t think he’s a “realistic hire” is because I’m thinking like an AD and less like a fan. Sure, fans want him because he was moderately successful at Texas Tech without elite talent. But, for an AD, hiring Leach would be a major PR risk. Regardless of whether Leach was right or wrong in the Adam James case, I think he’s a toxic asset. Not saying he can’t coach, just saying I wouldn’t hire him. No AD in his right mind is going to touch him. That’s just my opinion. (I could be wrong, because Tulane just interviewed him.)
I’m not demanding you to explain yourself, I’m asking you to explain why you’re so concerned with the talk of Mike Leach as a head coach on a speculative coaching thread that has also mentioned Peyton Manning and Butch Davis. Names get tossed around, people around here are giddy to get rid of Houston Nutt.
I’m fine with this. Speculate away. But aren’t I free to offer an opinion?
I’m sorry that it annoys you that so many of us like him.
Don’t be. People can like whoever they want.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
Who has been selected?
STRANGE: 1.) Nutt is fired with 3 weeks to go until the end of the season. #2) Boone to stay on until a replacement AD is found: 3.) People are working to find replacement AD: 4.) Recruits on hold, but waiting to see who new coach is.
Somebody has already: #1. Agreed to become the new coach, ##2. He has agreed to keep certain assistants: ###3.tolerate Boone until a new AD he can work with is found
I could deal with a majority of the folks mentioned
However, I want that coach to pound some discipline into our player’s heads. I’m talking, “drag a dude by his damn face mask and tell him he is adopted,” the fucking snap count is given to you literally 8 seconds before you put your damn hand on the ground yet we have false starts like it’s our job.
"Everybody relax, I'm here." - Jack Burton
by HottyToddyBraves on Nov 8, 2011 7:59 PM EST reply actions
False starts
infuriate me.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Bradley Sowell is the Earthquake to your Nitro Glycerin
The last Rankin Rebel
by Reb on the Rez on Nov 9, 2011 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
He is the antithesis
of all I love.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 9:41 AM EST up reply actions
Not Kirby Smart or RichRod
Kirby Smart gets too much credit for running a defense architected by Nick Sabin and stock full of first tier NFL prospects. RichRod couldnt win in a premiere conference so why would he fair better at a school where he probably cant even recruit comparable talent? We must face the facts we need someone who can field a competitive team using primarily second tier recruits. Who does that sound like? As much as i hate to admit it thats Mike Leach. Think about it he’d probably still be racking up wins and thousands of yards of offense if it wasnt for Craig James. Second choice Malzhan… Need someone that can develop a quarterback and a prolific offense at all costs. Smart and Rod dont fit the bill.
by 3rd and Bourbon on Nov 8, 2011 8:25 PM EST via mobile reply actions
ps texas has good players
and surely he can find us some good players from texas. They will want to come play for him and stick it to Texas A&M
by 3rd and Bourbon on Nov 8, 2011 8:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Dont count on it. Too many big school programs over here to play in. Moving to MS from Texas is like making an Apollo mission for a lot. Trust me. But thats one of the reason some of us actually go there. If football was on my mind I think I would find somewhere in Texas to play unless I couldnt, and then would I be someone we really wanted? I think not.
I don't think you realize
how much Waco and Lubbock suck.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
We can all pretend otherwise.
But I don’t think Oxford is exactly a big recruiting draw either.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
If we were purely recruiting kids from the suburbs of the DFW Metroplex,
then Oxford would be the biggest draw available.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 6:50 AM EST up reply actions
unless you are wanting spread offense kids
you don’t recruit the DFW Metroplex.
There are just a handfull of high schools in DFW that run a power O/strong D (Trinity comes to mind as one). An overwhelming majority of DFW high schools are running a tripped out version of the spread.
It kills me because I have been building my boy to be a top notch o-lineman since he started playing football. He is just in middle school now, and with his size and knowledge of the game, he won’t fit in the throw, throw, throw, throw, and throw some more world of DFW high schools.
Sorry for tangent… back to the coach argument
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
Eh
I think for skill position players, the type of offense doesn’t matter that much. You can either ball out or naw.
But with lineman, I think it makes a big difference. While a receiver or RB may not have to change that much, a lineman who’s never been in a three-point-stance might have trouble adjusting to a run-first offense where the QB lines up under center.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:56 PM EST up reply actions
I was more making a joke about the demographpics of the Ole Miss student body.
Nothing says “I’m an Ole Miss student” like “I grew up in a suburb of a Southern city.”
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You say Rich Rod couldn't win, then say Mike Leach is the man?
Exactly what championships did he win again?
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
Butch Davis
Dude is a program builder.
Red Cup Rebellion -- Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
by BrianWalker'sElbow on Nov 8, 2011 9:19 PM EST reply actions
And a program destroyer too.
Tyler Campbell for Heisman.
Official Member of the Busch Stadium Squirrel Fan Club.
He is the alpha and the omega.
/LookuponUNCanddespair
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 8, 2011 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
We need an alternate poll, Who would you NOT like to see as head coach?
I suspect Leach would win that as well.
I used to like Leach. But he’s a dick, and he’ll always be a dick. Just because he would be our dick doesn’t really mean that much to me. He would be a dick to our players, everyone in the AD department around him, and every time he approached the microphone with an Ole Miss logo he would also be a dick.
Just sayin’ he’s a dick. We don’t want that.
Well said.
Good to see that not everybody here fawns over Mike Leach.
by Meager Reader on Nov 8, 2011 9:50 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think he's necessarily a dick
just someone who has a very short fuse when dealing with dumbasses. I think he’s probably an OK guy to most rational respectable people.
I've met him, too.
Weird but otherwise nice guy was my experience. He told an off-color joke at the event we invited him to that made everybody squirm.
There are several creatures approaching from the Southeast...
Tell me.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
Something about
Him leaving his wife naked and tied up in their bed in Florida to come speak at our event. It got a few laughs but mostly just a lot of gasps and shaking heads. I met him very briefly after the event. He was friendly, funny, and most everyone seemed to like him. I liked him.
There are several creatures approaching from the Southeast...
Everyone I've heard...
except you, that has met him has nothing but nice things to say.
He’s kinda spacey and weird, but also pretty laid back off the field.
I do.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 8, 2011 10:08 PM EST up reply actions
Slow down
Before Leach is even considered an option we should probably check that he doesn’t have the Raider Rash. I can hardly imagine the horror if it were to mutate into a Rebel Rash.
Ole Miss: We Never Stop Rebuilding
Joe Paterno
He’s going to be available soon.
There are several creatures approaching from the Southeast...
by RobRob9 on Nov 9, 2011 12:03 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Only one thing concerns me with Sumlin...and its a small concern,
but a concern nonetheless. He’s had a record breaking and very capable QB slinging it around. Is Keenum a system QB or is he a once in a lifetime get? Im just concerned what kind of success he can have without a top notch QB.
Sidenote: It would take very little persuading for me to jump on the Sumlin bandwagon.
This hire needs to be thought out.
Don't quote me, boy...'cuz I ain't said $@#%
by ThemRebsIsHellDontThey on Nov 9, 2011 10:21 AM EST reply actions
P.S. I voted for RichRod.
Big fan of the option.
Don't quote me, boy...'cuz I ain't said $@#%
by ThemRebsIsHellDontThey on Nov 9, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
From Spencer Hall's The Alphabetical:
Y is for Yoko. Jeremiah Masoli will be remembered as the Yoko that broke up the Ole Miss Houston Nutt Recital Choir.
Please settle this argument. HOUSTON NUTT: GREAT OR SHITTY RECRUITER. vote below
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 11:31 AM EST reply actions
He couldn't recruit skill players.
No one wants to play for Ole Miss as a QB under Houston Nutt (he had the same problem at Arkansas). He also had trouble recruiting RBs. Those two positions are the two of the most important on the college football field (QB=most important on any field). It doesn’t matter how many 4 star WRs and OL you recruit when you can’t throw the ball or run it.
And in this whole “bad recruiter but good coach” – I don’t think he was either. He’s not like Orgeron (Perhaps the best recruiter while the worst coach of all time). Nutt is an average coach and an average recruiter. Average football coach. Period.
Completely agree.
Though, we did sign a 4star QB in Raymond Cotton. He just pussied out because he wanted to play and Nutt sent Stanley to the Manning Camp.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
I also feel a little sorry for Nutt.
It’s a different conference from the one he started in 13 (or however many years) years ago. It’s like a Fulmer situation – he just let time pass him by and didn’t evolve.
Then I realize he made ~3 million a year and I don’t feel as bad for him.
Agree - average recruiter, grossly inconsistent coach
He’s recruited decent players, but they haven’t shaken out as planned. I beileve he’s had enough to win six in the past two years. His tenure at Ole Miss will not be remebered for recruiting, but his failure to be consistent and to coach what he has.
If anything, the talent of the freshmen class and their game experience this season will be the basis for the team’s success in the next two plus years.
Long-time reader, first-time typer... Imma quit typin and read.
Agreed
People are acting like Nutt was a horrible recruiter. He signed average classes each year and had a pretty good one most recently. However, I think his coaching and organizational skills were much more detrimental to the program than his recruiting prowess (or lack thereof).
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
I am on the same page.
I think it’s wrong to call him a “bad recruiter” also. He wasn’t the best, but he was far from horrible. If he brought in one or two decent QBs who stayed, I think people would consider him above average (or at least average). It is that area that there is a glaring hole in his crootin’ resume.
I think the enemy’s minion RC was dead wrong in his article about how Nutt’s recruiting did him in. His lack of organizational skills and other administrative areas did him in. Plus he refuses to bring in a decent O-coordinator.
Nutt is an average recruiter but
He just is shitty at the people helping business
by rk9762 on Nov 9, 2011 4:28 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
How I measure if a coach is a good recruiter...
1) If he can get players that fit his system
2) The players that would make his system better that are in-state, don’t leave
3) He has a history of players that he recruits, on balance, improving as they move through the system.
Now this does not mean that all of the players that the coach recruits are four-five star studs and contribute each year that they are in the system. I trust coaches to have a better feel as to what is the best fit for their system more than recruiting services. They tend to look at the number of stars that coaches have brought in (regardless of the fit or other risks) to determine the quality of the class.
Also, I believe that you don’t judge recruiting classes by the number of stars you sign on signing day, you judge them three to four years later by the number of starters and the number of wins that the class has.
Pardon my Arkansas bent on this, but this is the perspective that I know, I am not piling on the Nutt hate. In Nutt’s last years at Fayetteville he lost three highly touted players (RB, QB and OL) that would have fit his system to Auburn. When those players found it better for them to go out of state (to a program with a new coach) than to go in state to a program that has recently put running quarterbacks in the NFL, developed O-linemen into top NFL draft picks, and had a back to back Heisman runner-up Runningback, then there were issues.
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
When you say
Also, I believe that you don’t judge recruiting classes by the number of stars you sign on signing day, you judge them three to four years later by the number of starters and the number of wins that the class has.
Should Nutt get the credit for the group of outgoing seniors at Arky? Wright, Adams, Childs, Bequette (sp?)
Again, I think he’s an average recruiter. Some recruits really love the dude, other’s don’t. He is able to sign some quality football players.
However, I have no problem saying he is below-average to terrible at player development and program-discipline. Were penalties and attrition always a big issue with Arkansas fans? I swear I want to punch my TV every time one of our lineman jumps offsides. We have averaged seven penalties a game, with over half of those being pre-snap infractions. That’s just a complete lack of discipline.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 10, 2011 4:32 PM EST up reply actions
Definitely not for Adams, Wright and Childs. They committed to the University AFTER Nutt left. In fact Joe Adams had committed to Southern Cal before Bobby Petrino came in. After Joe changed his commitment then Wright and Childs changed their commitment back to the Hogs.
For Jake Bequette, that is a totally different scenario. Jake is a third generation Hog. He would be a Razorback regardless who the coach is. I don’t think ANY coach can claim credit for Bequette being a hog.
Come to think about it, that senior class signed after Nutt left and Petrino was hired. Most of them may had been recruited and offered by the previous regime, but it was Petrino’s staff that signed them.
I agree that Nutt is an average recruiter. He gets some and he loses some that he should have otherwise signed. I think in the last few years he was trying to recruit to the “star system” and not to what was the best fit to his system.
Program discipline, Houston Nutt was HORRIBLE. His track record for number of players arrested, ticketed, fined, and otherwise for off the field issues is horrible. Hell, one of his players was arrested for being a pot distributor out of his apartment next to campus. When he was arrested he had massive amounts of pot in his premises with cash and guns. That news was hardly a shock to the system. (McFadden busted for fighting at a club, Matt Jones, etc etc). I don’t know if that has continued at Ole Miss. For on the field issues, his teams lacked leadership (except in rare occasions with exceptional players). There always seemed to be a bonehead penalty or play that led directly to a loss in games that should have been won.
For player development, I think you are correct. He had some outstanding talents while on the Hill. Cedrick Cobbs was a freak of nature, yet his best year was when he was a freshman. McFadden, Hillis and Felix were there together and there was little room for improvement in each, but all players can and should get better each year. I think the growth of Peyton Hillis was done because Hillis was a driven football player and he knew that he was not the “favored” back so he had to make it where the coaches had to put him in due to his work and performance. (I am a huge fan of Hillis).
Nutt is an amazing game day motivator. When he has things going, he can get a team to run through brick walls while dodging bullets. When the players “let go of the rope” the motivation doesn’t work. I hope for the same of Ole Miss that the team goes out with the belief that they are “auditioning” for next year (be it if they are wanting to play in the NFL or for Ole Miss). I would hate to see them go out and play like a team that has given up. I hope there are enough character guys on that team to keep them together regardless who is coaching them.
"I solemnly swear to tell the truth as I know it, the whole truth as I believe it to be, and nothing but what I think you need to know."
Appreciate the insight
good sir. And I literally had not thought about Cedrick Cobbs in five years.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 10, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
That article was delicious troll-craft
The shitty record, the shitty product on the field, and the shitty record again are why he was sacked.
You can try to argue recruiting = record, but then someone says “Ed Orgeron”, and you’re like "dur, whatever: I’m a State cheerleader, so I’ll write this anyway and maybe State will have a shot at more recruits this year. "
Long-time reader, first-time typer... Imma quit typin and read.
False dichotomy.
Red Cup Rebellion - Changing the Culture of Ole Miss Athletics
Sports are chaotic and stupid; and we're bad at them.
by The Ghost of Jay Cutler on Nov 9, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Logically fallacious arguments
are fallacious.
I see that you’re a big fan of argumentum ad populum and straw manning my points.
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 9, 2011 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
Straw Manning
Is he eligible yet? If we hire RichRod, do you think we’d have a shot at landing him?
by TwoYardsandaCloudofEnricky on Nov 9, 2011 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
I know someone said it earlier but I'll echo..
am I the only one that thinks that Randall Mackey (and Brunetti or, fingers crossed, Liggins) could do very well in Rich Rod’s system? Mackey may not have the height of Pat White, but he has a strong arm and has shown a lot of improvement the more he has play. Hell, I thought he played decent against Kentucky. Ja-Mes doesn’t drop that perfect pass and Moncrief doesn’t get called for pass interference and Mackey theoretically has a 3 TD performance. As for Leach, I think he could do some good things too and I think his personality, though polarizing to some, could be the jolt that knocks some of our fan base out of apathy.
"Leach...could be the jolt that knocks some of our fan base out of apathy."
Just parting company with Nutt and Boone did that for me. I can’t imagine what a dose of Mike Leach do.
Eschew obfuscation.
Can we please close some of these smaller public universities
Can we close some of these smaller universities in Miss., so the new coach, whoever he is, can have a chance? While the players at DSU, MSVU or the jucos’ will not all get scholarships to Ole Miss, they would create a very strong walk on system that you could find a hidden nugget from time to time. Is there any possibility of that being done?
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:16 PM EST reply actions
Closing public universities for football walk-ons
Is an outstanding idea.
The last Rankin Rebel
by Reb on the Rez on Nov 9, 2011 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
Seriously?
Reb,
You close them because we simply can’t support 8 public universities or whatever the number is with 2.9 million people. The math does not work for education or athletics. Haley Barbour submitted a plan to consolidate the universities on the same model. A state of 2.9 million does not jucos, HBC and three major universities. We just don’t. Now, if it helps our football team also, who am I to complain.
by RESPECT MY AUTHORITY on Nov 9, 2011 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
We need consolidation.
Not because of athletics, but because of the sheer cost of running all these damn places. While your at it, consolidate our 242,342 public school districts that all have their own administrators. I don’t think the average person understands how many administrators there are at one school district: superintendent, guidance counselor, federal programs coordinator, transportation coordinator, principal, assistant principal, food coordinator, athletics director, maintenance coordinator, secretaries for all these people, ect.
But we live in Mississippi and we love having elections and local districts more than we love fast food.
ELECTALLTHESUPERINTENDENTS
The last Rankin Rebel
by Reb on the Rez on Nov 9, 2011 4:32 PM EST up reply actions
Isn't that what walk-ons do anyway?
You know, walk on at a bigger school to prove themselves at a higher level. The other colleges in the state don’t prevent walk-ons, or a head coach’s ability to get juco transfers. Exhibit A: our zombie coaching staff’s penchant for juco transfers.
If anything that the existence of other football programs in the state may create proving grounds for more walk-ons and transfers.
Long-time reader, first-time typer... Imma quit typin and read.
Newly available
I hear a certain octogenarian from the commonwealth of pennsylvania might be looking for a new job
Gods!
A CBS blog said they were looking at Fedora. Please NO!
Graduated University of Mississippi Leonard McCoy School of Medicine, 2481
by SkylarkThibedeau on Nov 10, 2011 2:13 PM EST reply actions
I voted Other
For Tony Dungy.
Super Bowl Ring. Breaks the race barrier. All our problems end. He’s good friends with Archie.
Considering changing my name to RebelBlackBearsConception
by ColRebsLastBreath on Nov 10, 2011 2:27 PM EST reply actions
Dungy couldn't win but one Super Bowl with Peyton Manning
"A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to."-Gandalf
by Mexter Dccluster on Nov 10, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
That would shock everyone
in a good way. I’d be like O_o
I can’t really see him leaving the Colts for what has become one of the toughest jobs in the SEC, but anything’s possible.
by Meager Reader on Nov 10, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
He isn't the Colts coach anymore
He is in the broadcast booth for NBC on Sundays. FWIW, I have heard from two different places that Ole Miss has already reached out to him.
Considering changing my name to RebelBlackBearsConception
by ColRebsLastBreath on Nov 10, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
My mistake
I don’t follow pro football anymore. It doesn’t have the same spirit and pageantry as college football.
by Meager Reader on Nov 11, 2011 4:50 PM EST up reply actions
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